Vedhoggar
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Everything posted by Vedhoggar
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Ash plantation fell and extract price question
Vedhoggar replied to arbwork's topic in Forestry and Woodland management
Can be all of those things mentioned and the value of firewood has increased significantly in recently years. -
The word grove is derived from Anglo Saxon word grāf but no evidence as to what it meant other than it related to woodland however it is thought to be probably a small, defined area of managed woodland, normally surrounded by non-woodland (ref Rackham O 1976 Trees and Woodland In The British Landscape). An area of woodland which will go back to at least medieval times I know called the Grove would fit this description.
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You don't say if stands previously thinned or provide mean tree sizes or mean extraction distance in wood to ride but on what information you have put out ballpark around £30/T overall perhaps.
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Looks like it might be frost damage, some Christmas trees I have got hit with a late frost this year.
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If you are not aware the operating instructions/assembly info plus Briggs operators manual can be found in the black tube on opposite of machine to engine.
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There should be a prop on the underside of the beam between base plate and knife which flips up for transport and comes down to support it when in use, it must be down when unhitched and not in use too in horizontal position for safety reasons to prevent machine tipping backwards. We only use our machine vertically and need have to have it as a two handed operation for H&S reasons however I would have thought it would be a case of disengaging the log hold handle (Rock Machinery might advise you on this matter).
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Definitely made in China by Jiashan Superpower Tools and come with Briggs & Stratton engines (superpowerlogsplitter.com) - Rock Machinery assemble them in South Lanarkshire.
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Yeh, metre version 300 x 127 x 123cm compared to vertical splitter 228 x 114 x 122cm. Good luck with it ... I think you'll find it will split anything! The height of log hold handle on the left of machine can be adjusted at back of machine, mine was set a bit too low.
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Venom 22T with table, 22T ES and 20T metre version all have 2 stage pumps with cycle time on 22T table version 10 sec, 22T 12 sec and 20T metre version 20 secs as ram has further to travel but often ram only needs to go part way through to split log. The video on Rock Machinery website for 22T table version looks like it has been speeded up a bit to me.
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With Venom ES 22T was splitting 50-60cm long x about 60cm dia beech logs last summer and was about as much as I could get onto the base plate but once in position no problem splitting.
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Craigblues -two stage pump more efficient and ram has less distance to travel.
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Craigblues - with you now, my apologies as didn't realise there was a 20T Venom meter version (quite a saving £600). If you haven't used the ES 22T and feel the meter version would meet your needs better they might take back the one you purchased as decent lot to deal with ... plenty power but on the slow side.
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Craigblues you said "I wondered if I should of got the metre cutting length version" it depends on your process and how/where machine will be used, as well as budget. Smaller machines are lighter/easier to move around and it's also physically easier moving <60cm lengths of wood into position to split as well as stacking shorter billets. If dealing with a lot of open grown trees as found in gardens, farmland trees or arb waste there's often not a lot straight 1m lengths of cordwood in my experience. On the other hand if plantation grown wood and billets are to be sawn later say with a circular drum saw or processor then better with longer 1m splitting length. Cost also a big factor with some small road tow machines costing as little as £1,500 compared to >£5,000 for a good 1m road tow machine but they can be significantly faster to operate (AMR 12t with Honda engine impressive speed wise).
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trigger_andy you asked if splitter is hired out with or without an operator. The Venom 22T splitter has not been hired out although another splitter has with operator. Don't push mobile splitter hire but if opportunity arises I make it known that a machine is available for hire with an operator - domestic work on the whole, particularly where access difficult for larger machine/tractor. A hire company would charge about £80/day to £160/week for a machine like the Venom 22T road tow plus VAT. As to what you would charge with operator, well that depends on what you want/what you need in relation to overheads as well as going rate in area. Depreciation/running costs then form part of operating costs when day/hourly rate calculated.
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trigger_andy you are quite right as you say "when splitting in the vertical the log need not lift off the ground, just shuffle it onto the plate" which I do most of the time or lift it on with tongs but to comply with EN609-1 vertical splitters (not sure about horizontal splitters) have to have a log lifting device, the arm of which can be lowered onto the ground allowing the length of wood to be rolled onto the log lifting arm which can be hydraulic or mechanical as with the 22T ES, as the cylinder rises this lifts the wood to be split into position onto the base plate, it makes senses with 1m lengths of wood which can be heavy/impossible to manually lift but with 60cm lengths this is generally not an issue but to comply with EN regulation the machine has to have a log lifting device as I understand it but doesn't need to be used - short logs ca 25 cm would have to be roll or shuffled on to base plate anyway as they would be below the lifting bracket when raised.
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How are you going to get your firewood down to 20%?
Vedhoggar replied to cessna's topic in Firewood forum
Was sawing billets yesterday which were split/stacked outdoor on pallets but not sheeted in July 2019 (split down to <15cm) and the average MC reading in middle of fresh logs of the 45 tested was 19% with range 11 - 28% MC. -
trigger_andy in response to you question "Why would you need to lift a log if milling in the Vertical?" I believe it was an EU requirement relating to regulations for wedge splitters which were brought in around 2017/2018, personally I can see the need for a log lift with 1m vertical splitters but not smaller vertical splitters ... some of the changes made sense to me but others didn't.
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Yeh, thanks trigger_andy for pointing out typing error, will correct it. Bahco lifting tongs, next size up to one in your link, the 270mm jaw opening version (from clarkforest.com) most useful size and can be used for rolling logs as well as lifting, have a smaller set of tongs but use larger tongs most of the time.
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How are you going to get your firewood down to 20%?
Vedhoggar replied to cessna's topic in Firewood forum
Wood split into billets and stacked off the ground where the wind can get at it after one or two seasons, depending on species, on average will be <20% MC in my experience but then needs to be either sold before winter or moved under cover, putting a sheet over billets during winter will not keep wood dry enough and the moisture content even of wood that was <20% can increase to 25% under cover during winter. Lengths of timber that have been spit with excavator mounted cone spitters and stacked seem to season quite well too. -
We split mainly 50-60 cm long rounds into billets that would mostly be too heavy to lift manually, these are then stacked off the ground to season and later cut with circular saw into 20cm, 25cm, 30cm log lengths as required or sold as 50cm billets. If splitting smaller dia logs (<30cm) the 4 parts splitting knife could be used but we generally another machine for this. The lifting bracket ("the chain thing on the right hand side" you asked about) we don't use much, the lifting bracket lifts log as the cylinder rises but this doesn't need to be engaged (might have video of this in action). We use log pick (hookaroon) and lifting tongs (Bahco 270mm jaw opening) a lot instead of lifting bracket as quicker. Machine is used for both home and commercial purposes.
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Purchased the 22T ES 12 months ago from Rock Machinery to bust up logs too big to lift and nothing it hasn't managed to split so far. Have the 4 way splitting knife which slides over the single knife but it is not to be used on logs wider than dia of 4 way knife or the bolt holding might get damaged. We split mostly 50 and 60cm billets with it using the single knife. It is towed mainly along country back roads so 45 mph not an issue but if on main roads you do tend to get a bit of traffic building behind so travel at 50 mph at times. At £1500 it is good value. Have used the 22T Rock horizontal splitter but we found it uncomfortable/put strain on back.
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Witterings the cost materials for log store 12' x 6' x 6' (all tantalised wood) about £155 for and then labour two persons half a day to erect (local) plus half day to source material if not in hand ... robust design made to last. Single bay stores cost less to build but will amount to more than half this cost also 12' x 12' x 12' stores built. Not looking to take on any more work at the moment as have plenty on. On what to do with those pallets I would suggest cutting them up for kindling.
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Image of log shed design made for a number customers out of fencing materials with corrugated metal roof and removable pallet floor as well as recycled wood packaging crates given away to customers for storing logs (can be turned on side if open front required).
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Slatted will better for seasoning with air moving through logs above and below them also try to situate woodshed in most windy spot to make use of the wind as much as possible, ideally with front facing away from prevailing wind. If looking to keep about a years supply of wood in shed as the time needed to season logs differs very quick and fairly quick drying species would be most appropriate.
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NJA you asked about the Rock 12T electric splitter, judging by video on Rock website it looks painfully slow, the quality of rock machines are however okay in relation the the cost of the machines which are all made in China. You mention wanting to split 2 -3 ft dia logs, for logs this size in my experience a more powerful vertical splitter is required, with anything over 2ft in dia being difficult to man handle, the Rock 22T ES vertical petrol log splitter would be capable of splitting logs approaching 2ft in dia. Thor machines mentioned by davindales are well made but have only experience of 18T tractor version not electric. On noise it might not be an issue with a petrol engine for occasional use and if neighbours >50m or so away.
