Problems and issues this industry faces and how to deal with them.

[Will C]

Just now, Mick Dempsey said:

You can buy an angle grinder from B&Q, fix the brakes on your own car, and anyone else’s if you like. 
Sparkys and plumbers will burn your house down and blow your street up if they get it wrong, that’s why they have strict regulatory bodies.

A badly pruned tree is the worst outcome you’ll get from a shit tree surgeon.

A good point and a Fair reply 👍

[manco]

22 minutes ago, Mick Dempsey said:

You can buy an angle grinder from B&Q, fix the brakes on your own car, and anyone else’s if you like. 
Sparkys and plumbers will burn your house down and blow your street up if they get it wrong, that’s why they have strict regulatory bodies.

A badly pruned tree is the worst outcome you’ll get from a shit tree surgeon.

or a tree through the conservatory? branch through the greenhouse or the irreplaceable plant that was a wedding gift from granny maud? 

[AHPP]

You can do a lot of damage with an errant tree or tree part. And indeed a lot of damage with badly fettled brakes.

[Pete Mctree]

13 hours ago, 5thelement said:

The most recent version of the NPTC Small Tree Felling certification requires the candidate to explain/describe a whole series of felling cuts including step cut, spear cut , 80-20 front cut, V-cut, split level, standard fell, Danish cut, Dogs Tooth and when each cut is to be used, they also have to describe the cuts and their uses when doing their Ariel cutting certificate.

As an instructor I spend a lot of time explaining the physics of the cuts. Dimensions, hinge length/thickness, sink depth etc on the whiteboard before demonstrating all these cuts and their application.

The candidates will be expected to carry out these cuts using the correct methods, for the given tree bias, and will need to show this when being independently assessed.

 

Maybe it has been a long time since you did any training?

 

And the back cut doesn’t need to be higher than the sink.

I have been in the industry for well over 25 years and yes, I am current with updates 

This issue is something I have observed over many years, both those trained within industry and especially those who have come through college based apprenticeships - specifically I am thinking of two individuals who have both been trained and assessed within the last 4 years - so I am only speaking from recent observations . They can both cut accurately and with some proficiency however they were never taught the physics and why, just the “how”. It is this lack of “why” that presents the danger as the inability to make informed decisions is a serious handicap in life and tree work, as not everything in the world works when formula are applied across the board. 
I do welcome your approach to education, but I suggest you may be in the minority, as those I see leaving the institutions are not achieving what an employer or industry requires - which is a whole other subject ( &. I understand that it is impossible to deliver in the time frame and the funding available)

Sorry for the rambling rant, however I still say that training and education is holding back Arb and forestry in both productivity and safety .

 

Oh and I agree that the back cut does not need to be higher than the sink cut, but you need to know when…..🙃👍

[Puffingbilly413]

2 hours ago, Mick Dempsey said:

A badly pruned tree is the worst outcome you’ll get from a shit tree surgeon.

I can think of worse outcomes...

[Thesnarlingbadger]

To be completely honest I think that there isn’t really an issue or at least not one that hasn’t been going since the dawn of time with this. Yes our travelling friends will steal work from us, so what. It’s only when they steal my tools that I give a shit. Most my customer will happily pay an acceptable price provided I do a professional job. Yes this has become an issue recently due to cost of living but generally I have enough work to keep me busy, pay my bills and have a holiday. I agree with Mick, who cares if someone doesn’t consider me a skilled professional, if they pay then great if they don’t then I’ll kick off. And yes big site clearance jobs might not think you as a company or a climber have talent but they have picked you to do the work because either you have given them the best price or all you paperwork and H&S is in order. Those big companies aren’t going to have someone from a caravan site come and do the work because they are not professional. 
 As far as I’m concerned I do the quote get the job, do a good job, tidy up properly and get a call back next year. All good. 

[NwalesDero]

On 26/08/2022 at 09:48, Mr. Squirrel said:

 

It's a very good point that. I've spoken to people who have complained about how there aren't many decent climbers about, but have also turned their nose up at taking anyone inexperienced on. You can't have one without the other... Also, despite what some might think, we were all hopelessly useless at some point. 

I was told by 3 companies to go get experience and then they would consider taking me on. Most seem like they are not helping themselves to find people who want to work but happy to take on the people jumping job to job when they are found out how unreliable they are. This is why now I am paying my way through my own training and working at a local firm just cutting grass right now. 

[dan blocker]

On 26/08/2022 at 20:41, Mick Dempsey said:

You can buy an angle grinder from B&Q, fix the brakes on your own car, and anyone else’s if you like. 
Sparkys and plumbers will burn your house down and blow your street up if they get it wrong, that’s why they have strict regulatory bodies.

A badly pruned tree is the worst outcome you’ll get from a shit tree surgeon.

There’s a few tree bods that have caused power outages around the country and what about the clowns that put the tree across the road in London narrowly missing a cyclist and the crew that put the tree across the road between some parked cars narrowly missing the woman- can’t find the videos? Most house gas explosions are from DIY folk and electric faults from people bypassing the meters. The regs covering electrical and gas installation is a joke but at least they’re regulated. Treework is non -regulated except where some clients ask for copies of the teams quals, insurance certs and RAMs etc. The AA goes some way to try and  regulate/ control part of the tree industry.

 

[Clutchy]

The biggest problem in the UK arb game is that most tree companies are ran by tree surgeons and not as a business. 

 

Everything stems from that. 

[Mick Dempsey]

4 minutes ago, Clutchy said:

The biggest problem in the UK arb game is that most tree companies are ran by tree surgeons and not as a business. 

 

Everything stems from that. 

Enlarge on that please, not sure what you mean.