Kev Stephenson

Alternatively Rodgers plant hire have a depot in Rotherham and they have one. Doesn't have the reach of Deans though

In my eyes then you are hiring man and truck. They need to pay for the truck and you are the source of income, hence the high day rate. I am assuming the truck is for business and not an only mode of transport. If you choose not to use it then you are giving them money for nothing.

So are you hiring a groundie or a groundie and tipper? That makes a big difference

I am regularly sent CV's for fresh out of college climbers or climbers needing a bit more work willing to work for £80-100 per day. That is who is dropping the going rate not the main contractor. Don't forget this is up north, teams of 2 cannot command £500+ for the day, it just doesn't happen (thats a standard team, not mogs, loaders, etc). There is the odd day where you will exceed your day rate but not many. How much is an employed climber on? £400 a week? Are you telling me it costs £200 a week to run as a subbie climber (£600 takings - £400 wage)? Wet days - wear a waterproof (just like the main contractor). Sick days - main contractors have them too and by law you are not entitled to sick pay from your employer when employed so no difference there. Mozza, day rate, gut buster breakfast between jobs, 3.30pm finish. He couldn't ask for a better employer!! Lets put this another way. What percentage of the day rate should go to the subbie climber?

200T and a Husky 390XP ?? (model name I am unsure of but 28" ish husky). I have my own saws so a climber bringing there own is a bonus really but people prefer using their own kit. He turns up in a landy and isn't afraid to use the winch or tow my chipper off road if required, why own one if you can't/won't use it. £120 a day, £600 a week, £2400 a month not bad really. That is assuming subbing only.

Groundie subbies are few and far between. There are plenty of brash draggers but not proper groundies. I can't see why a tree company would need to hire the list as you describe. How much discount would I get for not using your chipper? How much discount for not needing your saws either? I have my own company with all the kit, sometimes I just need extra bodies. You price yourselves at £128 per man per day. I can get a top end climber for less than that with saws and a 4x4 and I will ground instead of climb for the day. For subbies that is too much money and what if I only want one of you? Hire yourself a climber, advertise and do your own jobs. That is about the only way you will see that money and from your description it appears you have all the necessary kit (tipper???). Sorry to be a bit negative but that is the way I see it.

The exhibitors need to pay stand fees, fuel to and from the show, hotel fees for all the staff for show days plus at least one before to set up and most are at rock bottom price wise anyway. If anything show prices should be higher than internet prices. What the show does give is the opportunity to pick and choose each item for a different supplier if you want to save a fiver here and there. The problem I find now is due to diesel prices and a hotel stop over I am already £250 in before I get to the first stall so I pick a choose the shows for the social scene not the show bargains.

Do you use diamond disk for sharpening? I take them off as I have 2 sets and use a green wheel on the bench grinder.

The last tank in the transit did me 6 weeks!! Last year it did just over 3,500 miles.

I've got basically the same machine badged as a Camon C500 and it's running Rayco super teeth which do the job but not very well and are a pain in the backside to change and resharpen. What sort of money is it to change the cutting system to the multi tip?

Treequip has done at least one, it belongs to armchairarborist. There are pics on the forum somewhere

I tell you what then as well as not paying the LEGAL minimum wage I will also fly tip to save on yard costs and operate without insurance to save even more then I can undercut you every day. For the record it is also against the law to be assisted in your work either payed or unpaid without employers liability insurance. I fully understand most people do the job for the price they decide and don't just look to price based on other quotes. I am the same and definately not the cheapest in the area however I get a lot of my work from recommendation not price so it doesn't matter to me. I don't mind people being cheaper than me, competition is healthy, but can we at least play on a level (and legal) playing field. There are dozens of threads posted on here about the industry being undervalued. People willing to offer a service for peanuts is what undervalues the trade.

But how does a legitimate company with a labourer wishing to earn a living not just beer money compete?

Again, you are paying your dad less than the national minimum wage which is against the law. Whay are you worth £7 per hour and your dad only worth £4?

You will definately be better at the APF in September. Much more kit on show for the forestry side of the job

Stump grinders cost from a couple of grand up to well in excess of £10k. Saying a grinder costs £3.5k is like saying a van costs £10k. There are so many variations of 'van' you can't just put a single price on. Grinding a stump is usually charged by the inch (£3 per inch for example would be £36 for a foot diameter stump) with a minimum charge or call out fee. However be careful as it is much easler to do 3 12" stumps next to each other than 1 36" stump. My local hire place do a push along grinder for £35 + VAT per day. Don't forget that they need fuel, transporting to and from site and there is your wages and insurances to cover. Based on your £130 hire cost the £245 you would look to charge would be bare minimum unless you could get more work in on the same day.

What do you plan on pulling it with for it to 'take 3 and a half ton'? Are you sure it isn't a 3.5 tonne gross trailer? Do you need the sides or is a flat bed good enough? Can you keep the ramps you already have? How much are you looking to sell yours for, price to change is the figure you need to be interested in

In your hourly rate of £6.25 how much of that are you expecting to see in your pocket? How much is your liability insurance and are you covered for tree work? How much did your vehicle insurance go up when you told them you needed business cover? How much have you spent on tools, trailers, etc to earn your first £500 and when will you hit break even? Do you charge for consumables (chains, 2 stroke oils, landscaping hardware and fixings, etc) Are you charging fuel or does that come out of the £6.25 as well? Who pays for the 4 hours you spent going to the dealers? You already earn £19k a year so for your landscaping work you will pay 20% tax and NI on the bit left after expenses, but you know that as an accountants clerk. The reason people complain about you charging £6.25 an hour is to run an honest business it is impossible to charge that little. The instant cash from a little bit of weekend work is great but watch how you operate and who you may upset by poaching work form legitimate companies who operate with insurances, tax, NI, etc, etc. Do you really think the accountancy company owner charges your services out to a client at £6.25 an hour? Try 3 or 4 times that. Everyone has to start somewhere and i wish you the best of luck but I would recommend doing less jobs at a proper price. You will make the same money in the end. Sit down and work out what it actually costs you to do the job legitimately or you could just end up being silly busy making no more than a pound an hour.

I agree with burytreeman otherwise this is just a husky vs stihl thread in another guise.

Like everything tree services are only worth what someone is willing to pay (and a lot of people are willing to pay as little as possible) so saying we are worth double isn't right. I understand that we do a more physical job that say a sparky or plumber who are possibly on a higher hourly rate but with significantly less overheads than us but because we do a more physical job does it mean we are worth more? Something someone once said to me is a plumber/sparky will fit something that will improve the customers life day in day out, we generally remove something that is a problem/inconvenience and in a months time they have forgotten what was there. If EVERYONE (including the nomadic loppers/out of work builders/gardeners/etc) refused to work as a team of 3 for less than £1000 a day then at some point the new rate would be accepted as tree work is necessary. However there will always be someone who would be willing to do it for £500 (for example) so that is the going rate.

Speech is free and you can do what you want. Steve owns and pays for the running of the forum so abide by the rules. Simples

Just done all the ones above, any help with numbers on mine much appreciated. Thanks

You need to see that the bat survey has been done before you start work. Are you removing and replanting or have you been contracted to do the removals leaving the replants to the client? I always state on written quotes and again on invoice that the replant is the specific responsibility of the client unless I am further instructed to do the sourcing/planting. By ensuring it is on the quote means if the client doesn't replant and the council come looking for an ass to chew you are covered in that before you started the job the client knew he would be responsible for the replant. Kev

Stolen from a locked workshop/log store over the weekend. The splitter was ground anchored to a solid concrete floor but they have got in hacksawed the padlock and away they go. Splitter is the same as the one in the link below with damage to the hinge point for one of the arms so easily identifiable Handy Pro THPLS7TP 7 Ton Vertical Petrol Log Splitter – Next Day Delivery Handy Pro THPLS7TP 7 Ton Vertical Petrol Log Splitter Lead flashing from a nearby house and 4 LIVE overhead power cables taken over the same weekend. Not happy!! Kev

Had these 2 last year. The porsche had 186,000 miles on and did a few track days in my ownership. New house down a bumpy track means I have 4x4's now as the low slung track toys won't go down to the house. Maybe next year when I have the barn sorted I will get something else. The 309 cost nothing. Bought from ebay for £100 as a non runner but I knew what was wrong with it (a £5 relay that I had in the spares box). Stripped the interior and sold the bits on ebay for about £140.