Why young un's don't stand a chance.

[Goaty]

Thing is, life and education are about working on your weaknesses, so if someone's handwriting/literacy skills are poor but they're good at say, mechanics then they should be pushed to improve their literacy.

Just because one is not very good at something useful, like maths, writing, languages doesn't mean they should be allowed to drop it.

 

 

That is true, you can't just give up. But there is a stop point. As you hopefully can tell by my posts. I can express myself, get my thoughts across. But just as I will never run 100m in under 10seconds my hand writing will never alter, believe me it's been pushed enough.

Yet I can work out and fix most things. That is a really underdeveloped skill these days.

I remember being given a class assignment to make a windmill that would lift up a small weight when blown upon. The whole class made tall towers with conventional vertical faced sails on four parallel legs. They all blew over. I made a tripod with a horizontally mounted rotor. It was stable and worked. But because I wasn't interested in writing a long essay of fibs about how I developed it. My marks were poor.

Tonight I've bought home a Volvo fm truck operators manual to read, to better utilise its new to me Ishift transmission. I jumped in this truck this morning figured out how it goes in less than two minutes and took it a mile down the road to get the trailer repaired.

I'm not trying to blow my own trumpet here, just illustrate a point. This is what makes me employable. I'd love to do a test and send kids in to school for career choice, telling their career advisors, I want to be a truck driver, a farmer, a fisherman. All jobs that keep us alive and essential to the country's success.

A teacher can only really advise with experience on being a teacher. Or aspirations. No disrespect to them they do a job I don't want. But it stagnates development outside their expertise and experience.

What subjects actually encourage these sort of life skills.

Give a kid a problem these days the answer is "I dunno" followed by if sufficiently interested a Google search.

The internet is just knowledge and I find it very useful. But it bypasses personal development.

Edited September 5, 2016 by Goaty

[Richard 1234]

Thing is, life and education are about working on your weaknesses, so if someone's handwriting/literacy skills are poor but they're good at say, mechanics then they should be pushed to improve their literacy.

Just because one is not very good at something useful, like maths, writing, languages doesn't mean they should be allowed to drop it.

 

 

Or they could be pushed to further excel I their mechanical abilities.

People learn far far more if they enjoy it.

Another point I think is that school is not for everyone. Why force kids to do maths English until they are 18 if they are never going to pass? Surely that time would be better spent doing something they may be good at and get better at that.

 

I don't see how making them miserable helps at all.

Just my opinion

[Mick Dempsey]

Fair play Goaty.

 

In reply to Richard1234.

 

Maths and English are basic life skills, kids should pushed and pushed and pushed in the basics.

 

I'm on an American forum as well as here, I've noticed how much better the level of written English is compared to on here.

 

If you take the mickey out of someone for a comical error they don't start screaming about bullying or being judgemental.

 

It's not about passing exams, it's about basic competence in the core subjects.

 

No one wants miserable kids but no one wants ill equipped youngsters poorly educated on the altar of "happiness"

[Richard 1234]

Fair play Goaty.

 

In reply to Richard1234.

 

Maths and English are basic life skills, kids should pushed and pushed and pushed in the basics.

 

I'm on an American forum as well as here, I've noticed how much better the level of written English is compared to on here.

 

If you take the mickey out of someone for a comical error they don't start screaming about bullying or being judgemental.

 

It's not about passing exams, it's about basic competence in the core subjects.

 

No one wants miserable kids but no one wants ill equipped youngsters poorly educated on the altar of "happiness"

 

 

I do agree that sometimes on here the spelling and grammar is shocking!

Not sure how they manage it really with spell checkers these days.

 

I "failed" maths and English (d in both)

Because I hated school.

Happiness is not what I was talking about. Actually getting these kids engaged in something they are good at was my point.

I have proved along with countless other that it is not everything to pass these tests.

The 3 Rs can come later if needed.

The system is obviously not working as it is so why not change it.

My wife is head of sixth form and she thinks it's stupid to keep forcing these kids to do these things as do most of her colleagues.

[aspenarb]

Or they could be pushed to further excel I their mechanical abilities.

People learn far far more if they enjoy it.

Another point I think is that school is not for everyone. Why force kids to do maths English until they are 18 if they are never going to pass? Surely that time would be better spent doing something they may be good at and get better at that.

 

I don't see how making them miserable helps at all.

Just my opinion

 

I am allowed one opinion a month so here it is .

 

I feel that schools should stop this crap of teaching kids to pass an exam in an attempt to boost a schools standing in the league tables and concentrate on teaching them the subjects properly. After eight years of schooling every child should have grasped basic literary skills and have an understanding of maths. The last couple of school years should be spent assessing/separating out those that will go on to higher education and those who will go on to be become manual workers/tradesmen, they could then adjust the pupils last years of education to benefit them in their chosen careers.

The construction industry ( as an example) is screaming out for tradesmen while laws are in place making it illegal to be on site under the age of eighteen, pure madness. At eighteen a lot of kids have left school and had a couple of years dossing , its a major struggle to bring them back from this.

 

Bob

[Lowestoft Firewood]

I am allowed one opinion a month so here it is .

 

I feel that schools should stop this crap of teaching kids to pass an exam in an attempt to boost a schools standing in the league tables and concentrate on teaching them the subjects properly. After eight years of schooling every child should have grasped basic literary skills and have an understanding of maths. The last couple of school years should be spent assessing/separating out those that will go on to higher education and those who will go on to be become manual workers/tradesmen, they could then adjust the pupils last years of education to benefit them in their chosen careers.

The construction industry ( as an example) is screaming out for tradesmen while laws are in place making it illegal to be on site under the age of eighteen, pure madness. At eighteen a lot of kids have left school and had a couple of years dossing , its a major struggle to bring them back from this.

 

Bob

 

There was a study done with prisoners, and when their vocabulary improved so did their behaviour. I think this highlights the importance of a good education.

 

A quote I noticed the other day, was that ''maths is everywhere, and in everything we do'', which when you think about it is very true, this doesn't mean that kids have to be forced into difficult exams, but to have a decent knowledge, which if teachers actually applied the principles to real life kids might actually want to learn and develop.

[Mick Dempsey]

I remember many many years ago I had a lesson in school in Home Economics or some such.

 

Anyway the teacher explained about buying a washing machine on finance, interest rates, payment schedules etc.

 

It was the first time I saw how mathematics operated in real life.

[oldwoodcutter]

I have a guy in his early twenties work for me in the winter (in the summer he does tractor work) . Now I didn't realise for a few weeks that he couldn't read or write except at what you would expect a 5 year old to do, but this doesn't bother me. His work ethic is beyond impressive, you could not want for a harder working lad. He is also immensely gifted in all things mechanical. He also has a photographic memory so for example instead of giving him a written way to drive to a job,which would be of no use to him, I have to tell him, and he remembers all the route that way,first time.How he passed his theory driving test I have no idea . He will never be prime minister, but he has adapted his adult life from what must have been tragic schooldays.

[Johny Walker]

imo,a lot off youngens seem to think us older ones owe them a living

[djbobbins]

I am allowed one opinion a month so here it is .

 

 

 

I feel that schools should stop this crap of teaching kids to pass an exam in an attempt to boost a schools standing in the league tables and concentrate on teaching them the subjects properly. After eight years of schooling every child should have grasped basic literary skills and have an understanding of maths. The last couple of school years should be spent assessing/separating out those that will go on to higher education and those who will go on to be become manual workers/tradesmen, they could then adjust the pupils last years of education to benefit them in their chosen careers.

 

The construction industry ( as an example) is screaming out for tradesmen while laws are in place making it illegal to be on site under the age of eighteen, pure madness. At eighteen a lot of kids have left school and had a couple of years dossing , its a major struggle to bring them back from this.

 

 

 

Bob

 

 

Not sure about the performance targets for schools but the (broadly) "one size fits all" assessment for kids is a flaw in my opinion.

 

The German system works in a different way and I think has some merit, although is perhaps a bit over prescriptive inasmuch as kids are destined from about the age of 12 to a certain type of education and this will set the course for their whole life.

 

From Wikipedia:

 

German secondary education includes five types of school. The Gymnasium is designed to prepare pupils for higher education and finishes with the final examination Abitur, after grade 12, mostly year 13. The Realschule has a broader range of emphasis for intermediate pupils and finishes with the final examination Mittlere Reife, after grade 10; the Hauptschule prepares pupils for vocational education and finishes with the final examination Hauptschulabschluss, after grade 9 and the Realschulabschluss after grade 10.

 

There are a couple more different types but the above I believe are the main ones.