Climbing without aerial rescue?

[Mick Dempsey]

Ok, thanks.

 

Personally I’d have got on and done it, real world scenarios and all that.

 

 

 

[Pete Mctree]

Sadly, having a qualified climber onsite guarantees nothing other than insurance.

There is a huge number of groundies who did there tickets & probably have not even put a harness on for 12 months, yet legally they are competent. It's a load of BS - you would bleed out whilst they remember which way round there spikes go on.

This is the way of modern business- as long as the boxes are ticked nobody cares about anything other than profit. There are always exceptions to this, but not enough.

[Mark Bolam]

There’s a lot of truth in that Pete.

I’m a job dependent type of guy.

 

If Im dismantling a 20’ cherry my usual groundie (who is also a climber) probably won’t even have his harness with him.

On big gnarly jobs the boxes are all ticked.

 

The real truth is though, if it goes tits up you need to get yourself down or you won’t be getting down.

[Steve Bullman]

Spot on Pete

[Khriss]

Definately expect myself to escape from up a tree - wouldn't rely on ground rescue - If I can't then am done for  :/ K

[Gary Prentice]

32 minutes ago, Pete Mctree said:

Sadly, having a qualified climber onsite guarantees nothing other than insurance.

There is a huge number of groundies who did there tickets & probably have not even put a harness on for 12 months, yet legally they are competent. It's a load of BS - you would bleed out whilst they remember which way round there spikes go on.

This is the way of modern business- as long as the boxes are ticked nobody cares about anything other than profit. There are always exceptions to this, but not enough.

At last some pragmatism. Unless climbing and rescue is regularly practiced by the 'rescuer' you're pretty much screwed. I dropped a 'rescue scenario' into a live job one day, everyone knew the crack apart from the competent climber who was suddenly informed to get out of his tree cos I'd passed out in another one. The sheer panic in his face was comical, they let him get to the bottom of my tree and then had to stop the drill because he was panicking too much for anyone to have confidence in his own ability to ascend safely. 

 

Even after he knew that it wasn't for real, the adrenaline spoiled his performance and he pretty much forgot everything he knew anyway, so I still had to regain consciousness to walk him through everything. Try that with a lad with a ticket passed some time in the past.

 

 

 

 

[Gary Prentice]

To add to my last post, on a Mountain Rescue crag course I was told about another member who had done okay through the training until the last exercise. The task was to abseil down a rock face, secure an injured rock-climber harness to harness, cut the injured climbers rope and then continue downwards to the base of the crag. Pretty straight forward, with everyone on a second line belayed from the top for safety.

 

Now this fellow had no issues with the previous days training, seemed confident in the abseil part and showed that he grasped the concepts. He got down to the victim, secured him and pulled a bloody great bowie knife out of the sheaf on his belt. First error was slicing a slash in his own buttock. With blood running down his leg he went to sever the victims rope and promptly slashed his cheek! Nice duelling scar.

 

The victim wrested the knife off him as he then tried to sever his own line instead of the injured parties one, which they were both attached too by then.

I can imagine a very similar scenario with many rescue ticket holders.    

[Martin du Preez]

First let me say I would never let any of my guys climb without someone with rescue on site. However when it comes to it doesn’t phase me. In the end of the day if it’s a serious enough accident to require rescue it’ll most likely be a severed artery... I stand to be corrected but I remember the pass time being capped at 40mins... as long as your groundies keep your ropes tidy self rescue is surely the only way... any worse than that you’re gunna be a gonna anyway

[Con]

Aerial rescue is definitely one of those situations where 'prevention is better than cure'. But even when all precautions are taken things happen.

What's dissapointing is, we do everything we can to satisfy hse, insurance companies and when something happens, as in Sean's case, it's still a battle. 

Incidentally,  who climbs with a first aid kit? 

I may be heading for a slating here, but l don't. If l nick myself l either carry on or come down and sort it out, if it was serious, what on earth can you do in a tree with a first aid kit!

 

Edited August 9, 2018 by Con

[Haironyourchest]

You could also use a system involving a base tie and cammed descender device that would allow the groundie to lower the climber remotely. This would be easy to train as well. Can also be used with Drt - to hoist the drt system. Now, if the climber is stuck, it's not going to work, but it would certainly increase the chance of a rescue overall.