Making the news today....

[daveatdave]

where do i start? dogger bank wind farm laying cabled now to just south of Bridlington. they are stopping private landowners from putting up turbines on their land. thermal heat pumps cost more to run than gas boilers and will not produce the same heat. smart meters can be shut off by the supplier remotely. importing wood pellets from America and Canada and will not use any of the waist from Uk tree surgeons which must be thousands of tons per year. solar panels are about spent by the time they have paid for themselves. the last figures I heard was the UK produced 1%of the global greenhouse gas that causes global heating so if we went 0% it would not make a shit of difference. Thay blame the car drivers and coal and wood burners never mention the military conflicts that have gone on for years around the globe. then all the people flying away on there holls the airlines planting trees to offset their carbon footprint then beavers are interduce which fell more trees than are being planted 

its late now off to bed     

[Mark Bolam]

The ramblings of a drunken man turn out to be one of the most accurate posts on here.

The sad reality is that even if we bend over backwards and become completely eco friendly, green, carbon neutral vegans it won’t make any difference because the Chinese, Indians, Yanks and Russians don’t give a shit.

[openspaceman]

1 hour ago, Mark Bolam said:

 

The sad reality is that even if we bend over backwards and become completely eco friendly, green, carbon neutral vegans it won’t make any difference because the Chinese, Indians, Yanks and Russians don’t give a shit.

This bit is right

[openspaceman]

10 hours ago, sime42 said:

 

 

Why as a country are we not grasping this opportunity to invest in our own renewable energy industry? 🤷‍♂️🤷‍♂️ We've just about still got the skills and knowledge to make all the stuff here in the UK. This could be our ticket to reviving our all but extinct manufacturing industry.

 

 

Too many reasons but the basic one is the culture of investment here, we have a high wage economy and a desirable living environment that has attracted a lot of inward investment in property. The capital gains have been so high that it has provided better returns than investment in production. This has gone on so long that manufacturing has failed to attract investment for decades and now will never catch up.

 

Simply put our wages mean manufacturers cannot compete with imports, thus there are better places for the wealthy to invest their money.

 

Those of us who work in rich peoples gardens  realise we are servicing their wants because it pays us better than being involved in production or manufacturing.

 

PS I have never worked in a factory and never wanted to.

[Stere]

Quote

thermal heat pumps cost more to run than gas boilers and will not produce the same heat.

 

That depends on if they also install a good lvl of  insulation plus underfloor heating etc that works at lower temps plus on future gas  & electric prices?

 

Think problem isn't  the technology its poor workmanship or having the regulation in place  so they are  done to a decent minimum standard.

 

 

 

Other  EU goverements seem to be investing  more than the UK in eco stuff

 

https://www.cbi.org.uk/media/rdkjcb4u/green-growth_supplementary-release_jan-2023_final.pdf

 

Quote

The UK now has one of the lowest proportions of spending to address climate change of many
comparable global economies, with France having committed over twice and Germany over four
times as much spend.

 

Edited August 6, 2023 by Stere

[Johnsond]

42 minutes ago, Stere said:

 

That depends on if they also install a good lvl of  insulation plus underfloor heating etc that works at lower temps plus on future gas  & electric prices?

 

Think problem isn't  the technology its poor workmanship or having the regulation in place  so they are  done to a decent minimum standard.

 

 

 

Other  EU goverements seem to be investing  more than the UK in eco stuff

 

https://www.cbi.org.uk/media/rdkjcb4u/green-growth_supplementary-release_jan-2023_final.pdf

 

 

I stayed in a new build ultra well insulated etc etc holiday cottage built to the highest specifications ( with solar panels) up in Uist last winter with an air source heat pump set up. The landlord was moaning  big time at the cost of running it and from my experience despite operating it as instructed the place was bloody freezing ( I don’t mind a cool house neither) and had limited hot water capacity. Ok maybe 3 working guys coming and going at the same time and expecting to shower in the evening placed nonstandard demands on  system but I was not impressed. 

[Stere]

Maybe it wasn't as good a job as claimed by the installers....

 

Norway & Sweden have adopted the technology  did they make a mistake ?

 

 

[Johnsond]

5 minutes ago, Stere said:

Maybe it wasn't as good a job as claimed by the installers....

 

Norway & Sweden have adopted the technology  did they make a mistake ?

 

 

No idea about Sweden and Norway I’m just giving you a first hand account of what I found. What do you use by the way ?? 

I’ve spent enough time in winter in Finland to know they do something right over there. Houses were for my taste uncomfortably warm most of the time. Pretty sure nuclear was the predominant power source at the time. 
The stove in the pic is the main heat source for my house 5KW running on milling waste 👍👍I’ll take that any day over the set up he had in Uist. 

Edited August 6, 2023 by Johnsond

[Big J]

26 minutes ago, Johnsond said:

No idea about Sweden and Norway I’m just giving you a first hand account of what I found. What do you use by the way ?? 

I’ve spent enough time in winter in Finland to know they do something right over there. Houses were for my taste uncomfortably warm most of the time. Pretty sure nuclear was the predominant power source at the time. 
The stove in the pic is the main heat source for my house 5KW running on milling waste 👍👍I’ll take that any day over the set up he had in Uist. 

 

I find that many of our friends and acquaintances here heat their house to a level that is beyond my comfort level. I do run hot most of the time, I should say.

 

All new heating installations here (with maybe a few exceptions) are heat pumps. Air/air, air/water and ground/water. Plenty of people are still using pellet boilers for their central heating, but I don't see any being installed. 

 

For me, the best thing is that it's much cheaper than fossil fuel direct heating. 300-440% efficiency and the ability to cool in summer. In winter it's much colder than anywhere in the UK and in summer hottter too. If it can be done here, it can be done in the UK.

[Steven P]

Air source heat pump prices - you are comparing an electrically heated house with a gas heated house.... you need to compare like for like, electrically heated vs. electrically heated and there you will find air/ground source heat pumps are cheaper. Not everyone has a gas supply, but gas costs 1/3 of electricity for the same heat?

 

Solar panels, wind mills or whatever you can do at home, lose out a lot if you export the power when you have to much and import it again when you need it (say you sell at 10p/kwh and buy at 30p/kwh), if you can use the power directly you gain more, so a battery needed or do heating with it as and when you can (even hot water)