Making the news today....

[the village idiot]

13 minutes ago, Haironyourchest said:

One year of Trump, US growth at 3.6%. growth under Obama was like 1.1 for 7 years. Black unemployment at all time low. Illegal border crossings down. Multinationals moving back to USA. Yeah, he's definitely cognitively impaired though, and an amoral racist...

You have to look at the whole picture though Hairychest.

 

Trump has recently revealed plans to allow offshore oil drilling in almost all of America's coastal waters, overturning a ban on offshore drilling put in place by Obama.

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/01/04/climate/trump-offshore-drilling.html

 

His rationale for overturning the ban is that it "deprives our country of potentially thousands and thousands of jobs and billions of dollars in wealth"

 

This type of rhetoric makes me very sad. America is already a fabulously wealthy country, but this isn't enough. Trump is willing to put the viability of our planet at very real risk in order to accumulate even more wealth. We all know where the large proportion of this extra profit will end up.

 

This is hideously amoral and stupifyingly selfish. Not least because he has other options, the benefits of which could massively outweigh the financial gains he so craves, if only he would consider them.

 

If America had the will and the necessary direction from the top they could easily become the dominant world power in sustainable energy production, creating 'thousands and thousands of jobs and billions of dollars in wealth' without putting the rest of the world's home at risk.

 

The World is changing, people are changing, but Trump is clinging on to some delusional vision of past national glory, sucking up the selfish into his tornado of misguided chaos.

 

Growth and national identity are not the be all and end all. They don't make people lastingly happy past a certain low level. Experiences, social connectedness and understanding one's self make us lastingly happy, extra stuff and insular thinking appears to make us happy but beyond the extreme short term it really doesn't. Trump doesn't understand this, or chooses not to. I don't think it's overblown to say that he is holding the world back. He needs to get over himself, bugger off, and let us continue to work towards a truly sustainable future.

 

Obviously it's not just Trump, but his position of immense power means we need to give him particular focus.

 

Peace. Out.

 

 

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

18 minutes ago, the village idiot said:

You have to look at the whole picture though Hairychest.

 

Trump has recently revealed plans to allow offshore oil drilling in almost all of America's coastal waters, overturning a ban on offshore drilling put in place by Obama.

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/01/04/climate/trump-offshore-drilling.html

 

His rationale for overturning the ban is that it "deprives our country of potentially thousands and thousands of jobs and billions of dollars in wealth"

 

This type of rhetoric makes me very sad. America is already a fabulously wealthy country, but this isn't enough. Trump is willing to put the viability of our planet at very real risk in order to accumulate even more wealth. We all know where the large proportion of this extra profit will end up.

 

This is hideously amoral and stupifyingly selfish. Not least because he has other options, the benefits of which could massively outweigh the financial gains he so craves, if only he would consider them.

 

If America had the will and the necessary direction from the top they could easily become the dominant world power in sustainable energy production, creating 'thousands and thousands of jobs and billions of dollars in wealth' without putting the rest of the world's home at risk.

 

The World is changing, people are changing, but Trump is clinging on to some delusional vision of past national glory, sucking up the selfish into his tornado of misguided chaos.

 

Growth and national identity are not the be all and end all. They don't make people lastingly happy past a certain low level. Experiences, social connectedness and understanding one's self make us lastingly happy, extra stuff and insular thinking appears to make us happy but beyond the extreme short term it really doesn't. Trump doesn't understand this, or chooses not to. I don't think it's overblown to say that he is holding the world back. He needs to get over himself, bugger off, and let us continue to work towards a truly sustainable future.

 

Obviously it's not just Trump, but his position of immense power means we need to give him particular focus.

 

Peace. Out.

 

 

Tough questions to answer from your post VI, but in the spirit of wholepictureness....

 

There's much to agree with regarding the opportunity to reduce oil dependency versus the expansion of new oil field exploration.  But, in the absence of a reduction in oil dependency, is it better to allow disproportionate influence on world political stability through volatile foreign oil sources or to 'bring it home' where localised control, investment and employment might provide fringe benefits?

 

I'd wholeheartedly agree, and support, a serious attempt to explore viable alternatives that would reduce oil dependency.  Can't realistically see it ever coming to fruition on a single national level because the organic political systems lend themselves towards short term 'remain in office' motives rather than long term 'human' benefit.  You've only to look to the Hinckley scenario and UK power deficit to see how politicians fail on the prospect of planning past the next election.  And I don't think anyone is seriously going to try and argue that Trump is a strategic thinker in the 50-100 year time frame.  

 

Tough choices:

 

- an international effort to explore energy sources of the future, unlikely without major political shift.

- Global population control / reduction - even tougher choice but the most viable option to reduce oil dependency.

- Leave things as they are because the "shitholes" have all the oil and it would be immoral to deprive them of that little income they currently have - with all of the wealth that oil has provided to "shitholes" there aren't many that stand up as an example of equitable sharing of wealth throughout the population.

- Can we blame Trump for the failure of generations of politicians to address the issues that we currently have?  I don't think so, leastways not with a clear conscience and an open mind.

 

Still thinking.....

 

 

 

[Rough Hewn]

Isn't Bhutan one of the Buddhist countries to use genocide to remove 100,000 non natives ?
Massively corrupt and have a tendency to lie about happiness and the environment?

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

 

[matelot]

Tbh, the media get all hysterical about the racist things Trump says. However I bet most people actually agree with him....

 

Let's be honest, I bet most white people actually prefer living in a white country. 

[Haironyourchest]

6 hours ago, the village idiot said:

You have to look at the whole picture though Hairychest.

 

Trump has recently revealed plans to allow offshore oil drilling in almost all of America's coastal waters, overturning a ban on offshore drilling put in place by Obama.

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/01/04/climate/trump-offshore-drilling.html

 

His rationale for overturning the ban is that it "deprives our country of potentially thousands and thousands of jobs and billions of dollars in wealth"

 

This type of rhetoric makes me very sad. America is already a fabulously wealthy country, but this isn't enough. Trump is willing to put the viability of our planet at very real risk in order to accumulate even more wealth. We all know where the large proportion of this extra profit will end up.

 

This is hideously amoral and stupifyingly selfish. Not least because he has other options, the benefits of which could massively outweigh the financial gains he so craves, if only he would consider them.

 

If America had the will and the necessary direction from the top they could easily become the dominant world power in sustainable energy production, creating 'thousands and thousands of jobs and billions of dollars in wealth' without putting the rest of the world's home at risk.

 

The World is changing, people are changing, but Trump is clinging on to some delusional vision of past national glory, sucking up the selfish into his tornado of misguided chaos.

 

Growth and national identity are not the be all and end all. They don't make people lastingly happy past a certain low level. Experiences, social connectedness and understanding one's self make us lastingly happy, extra stuff and insular thinking appears to make us happy but beyond the extreme short term it really doesn't. Trump doesn't understand this, or chooses not to. I don't think it's overblown to say that he is holding the world back. He needs to get over himself, bugger off, and let us continue to work towards a truly sustainable future.

 

Obviously it's not just Trump, but his position of immense power means we need to give him particular focus.

 

Peace. Out.

 

 

Yes I understand your viewpoint VI, but I and probably two thirds of the world's population believe it to be wrong and misguided, just as you believe our viewpoint to be wrong. In the long term, that is. Drilling in the gulf will not destroy the environment or the climate. It simply will not. That is what we believe. There is no downside to drilling for oil, anywhere at any time, none whatsoever. We do not believe the media and leftist-government inspired "narrative" of AGW. We just don't buy it. When we run out of crude oil we can start tapping the hydromethane deposits, which currently hold three times more energy than all the known fossil fuel reserves ever discovered. Unlimited growth for centuries is what we expect the future to be. We don't want redistribution of our wealth to the third world, or the lazy in the first world. We want everyone to work and thrive, all the world over. We want strong national identities, all the world over, preferably on friendly terms. That is true diversity, different cultures in different places with strong borders to keep them distinct and seperate. If people want to change cultures, more power to them, but the mixing of cultures in the same place and the resulting conflicting moral and legal norms - we don't want. We just see the nature of man and the world from a different perspective...see, I can sympathise where you're coming from and where the Trump haters are coming from because I was one once. I used to long for global governance, world peace, fairness for all, etc. I've gradually gone over to the other side though. I see Trump as literally the Hail Mary Pass that saved humanity from an eventual communist style world government. Its like the magic eye pictures, reality looks like something, then you adjust your brain a bit, and it suddenly looks like something else...its a funny old life..

 

You're a good sort though, VI, and I believe you feel the same way about Trump as most of my friends, and I'm still friends with most of my friends! - I'm not trying to troll you, I just feel a moral obligation to defend Trump and his agenda from time to time.

Edited January 19, 2018 by Haironyourchest

[billpierce]

Yes I understand your viewpoint VI, but I and probably two thirds of the world's population believe it to be wrong and misguided, just as you believe our viewpoint to be wrong. In the long term, that is. Drilling in the gulf will not destroy the environment or the climate. It simply will not. That is what we believe. There is no downside to drilling for oil, anywhere at any time, none whatsoever. We do not believe the media and leftist-government inspired "narrative" of AGW. We just don't buy it. When we run out of crude oil we can start tapping the hydromethane deposits, which currently hold three times more energy than all the known fossil fuel reserves ever discovered. Unlimited growth for centuries is what we expect the future to be. We don't want redistribution of our wealth to the third world, or the lazy in the first world. We want everyone to work and thrive, all the world over. We want strong national identities, all the world over, preferably on friendly terms. That is true diversity, different cultures in different places with strong borders to keep them distinct and seperate. If people want to change cultures, more power to them, but the mixing of cultures in the same place and the resulting conflicting moral and legal norms - we don't want. We just see the nature of man and the world from a different perspective...see, I can sympathise where you're coming from and where the Trump haters are coming from because I was one once. I used to long for global governance, world peace, fairness for all, etc. I've gradually gone over to the other side though. I see Trump as literally the Hail Mary Pass that saved humanity from an eventual communist style world government. Its like the magic eye pictures, reality looks like something, then you adjust your brain a bit, and it suddenly looks like something else...its a funny old life..
 
You're a good sort though, VI, and I believe you feel the same way about Trump as most of my friends, and I'm still friends with most of my friends! - I'm not trying to troll you, I just feel a moral obligation to defend Trump and his agenda from time to time.

Disagree with you, but highly commend your manner of discussion, refreshing!

[forestboy1978]

34 minutes ago, Haironyourchest said:

Yes I understand your viewpoint VI, but I and probably two thirds of the world's population believe it to be wrong and misguided, just as you believe our viewpoint to be wrong. In the long term, that is. Drilling in the gulf will not destroy the environment or the climate. It simply will not. That is what we believe. There is no downside to drilling for oil, anywhere at any time, none whatsoever. We do not believe the media and leftist-government inspired "narrative" of AGW. We just don't buy it. When we run out of crude oil we can start tapping the hydromethane deposits, which currently hold three times more energy than all the known fossil fuel reserves ever discovered. Unlimited growth for centuries is what we expect the future to be. We don't want redistribution of our wealth to the third world, or the lazy in the first world. We want everyone to work and thrive, all the world over. We want strong national identities, all the world over, preferably on friendly terms. That is true diversity, different cultures in different places with strong borders to keep them distinct and seperate. If people want to change cultures, more power to them, but the mixing of cultures in the same place and the resulting conflicting moral and legal norms - we don't want. We just see the nature of man and the world from a different perspective...see, I can sympathise where you're coming from and where the Trump haters are coming from because I was one once. I used to long for global governance, world peace, fairness for all, etc. I've gradually gone over to the other side though. I see Trump as literally the Hail Mary Pass that saved humanity from an eventual communist style world government. Its like the magic eye pictures, reality looks like something, then you adjust your brain a bit, and it suddenly looks like something else...its a funny old life..

 

You're a good sort though, VI, and I believe you feel the same way about Trump as most of my friends, and I'm still friends with most of my friends! - I'm not trying to troll you, I just feel a moral obligation to defend Trump and his agenda from time to time.

AMEN!! I also see Trump as the saviour of the communist world government that we are heading towards. 

[the village idiot]

6 hours ago, Rough Hewn said:

Isn't Bhutan one of the Buddhist countries to use genocide to remove 100,000 non natives ?
Massively corrupt and have a tendency to lie about happiness and the environment?

Good point.

 

Bhutan has a dark past, as do most nations. What really matters is their motives now and into the future.

 

Done a bit of research on the corruption thing.

 

Bhutan ranks 27th out of 176 countries in the corruption index (1 being the least corrupt-Denmark, 176 being the most corrupt-Somalia)

27th is extremely good compared to other countries in the region. They rank better than Israel and only 4 places below France. I think 'massively corrupt' is a bit of an overstatement.

 

Don't know about the lying thing. Looks like Bhutan is not the pristine example of a country doing all the right things. They are certainly saying the right things (in my view) hopefully they can contine to back this up with action.

 

Worth keeping an eye on.

[Khriss]

I think all those shirts n coats come from there - Bhutan - very colorful K