Climate change anyone?

[openspaceman]

30 minutes ago, AHPP said:

The only proper regulation of a market is what comes from within the market. It’s the sadly more prevalent regulation of markets (interfering) by outsiders like government that fvcks stuff up and makes people erroneously blame capitalism.

This is patently not so, without regulation we would have far more pollution, not to mention slavery and other abuses of workers.

[sime42]

It seems to me that local government  attracts a lot of people looking for security and avoiding working but that's another matter.
 
As to green waste; I think that too came as a result of someone in a LA realising that  while there was no mandate to collect it  once it was collected and sent to a composting facility it counted as recycling and in one hit put the recycling percentage up.
 
As I have mentioned here before I think, once collected,  green waste would be better used by fixing the carbon in it  rather than composing it and returning the carbon to the atmosphere

This is interesting, not heard of this idea before. How do you fix the carbon in green waste? And how do you stop it from composting itself?

[AHPP]

This is patently not so, without regulation we would have far more pollution, not to mention slavery and other abuses of workers.

As opposed to the slavery and other abuses that governments inflict on workers? Tax freedom day fell on the 30th May last year. Until the 29th May inclusive, UK workers worked to pay taxes only. Half the year, they worked for the state.
And governments are the worst polluters. When was the last time you shot depleted uranium at your neighbours?

[trigger_andy]

Just now, AHPP said:

When was the last time you shot depleted uranium at your neighbours?

I would if I could.  

[openspaceman]

4 minutes ago, AHPP said:

And governments are the worst polluters. When was the last time you shot depleted uranium at your neighbours?

non sequitur

 

anyway what makes you think I think current government in UK is any good at regulation, which is what we were discussing. In fact everything points to  that growth in wealth disparity since 1970 is going the way to favour people with wealth aspirations by removing resources from regulators.

[openspaceman]

11 minutes ago, sime42 said:

How do you fix the carbon in green waste? And how do you stop it from composting itself?

By pyrolysing it. Fixed carbon in woody waste is about 15% of the dry matter in woody waste, less in non lignin containing stuff. At lower temperatures there is more yield but the tars in the char are less recalcitrant but still fairly long lasting.

 

The term coined for using this char to store carbon in the soil long term, by a late ex-pat, Peter Read, is biochar.

 

The challenge is to make this biochar from high moisture content green waste and utilise the heat in the process.

 

 

[AHPP]

non sequitur
 
anyway what makes you think I think current government in UK is any good at regulation, which is what we were discussing. In fact everything points to  that growth in wealth disparity since 1970 is going the way to favour people with wealth aspirations by removing resources from regulators.

It does follow. What on earth makes you think that people who pollute appallingly are worthy of regulating how others pollute? If the example is too abstract, consider the millions of chair polishing jobs that only exist to impose and then satisfy state regulations. All those people drive to work, buy shoes they wouldn’t otherwise buy, get packaged sandwiches for lunch they wouldn’t otherwise need etc etc ad infinitum ad nauseam.
Why do I think you think state regulation of stuff is good? You called for it a few posts up.

[openspaceman]

21 minutes ago, AHPP said:

It does follow. What on earth makes you think that people who pollute appallingly are worthy of regulating how others pollute? If the example is too abstract, consider the millions of chair polishing jobs that only exist to impose and then satisfy state regulations. All those people drive to work, buy shoes they wouldn’t otherwise buy, get packaged sandwiches for lunch they wouldn’t otherwise need etc etc ad infinitum ad nauseam.
Why do I think you think state regulation of stuff is good? You called for it a few posts up.

I actually said regulation, not state regulation, but yes generally voluntary codes fail so the state is the overarching authority.

 

Anyway as with many of these discussions our views are so widely divergent there is no point continuing, I have propounded some of my views on the subject, you reject them and therefore no common ground to make sensible discussion possible.

[AHPP]

21 minutes ago, openspaceman said:

I actually said regulation, not state regulation, but yes generally voluntary codes fail so the state is the overarching authority.

 

Anyway as with many of these discussions our views are so widely divergent there is no point continuing, I have propounded some of my views on the subject, you reject them and therefore no common ground to make sensible discussion possible.

It was implied if not said.

 

I'm surprisingly open minded btw. All you have to be is right.

[sime42]

The only proper regulation of a market is what comes from within the market. It’s the sadly more prevalent regulation of markets (interfering) by outsiders like government that fvcks stuff up and makes people erroneously blame capitalism.

So I bought some frozen white fish the other day from a supermarket. On reading the description it turns out that it's Alaskan Pollock packed in China. So it's traveled from Alaska to China to the UK. The food miles involved in that make me shudder. Surely that's a massive failure of the market, or the capitalist system. The sooner we stop doing stuff like that the better. It's crazy. That must need some kind of regulation.
If Brexit fixes problems like that then great, there is a silver lining to the cloud. I doubt it though. I heard today that we only produce 50% of our own food, the other 50% is imported. So if we reduce trade with our neighbours in Europe then we'll be forced to import more food from further around the globe. Hence more food miles. Not good.