Making the news today....

[Rough Hewn]

Tbh, the media get all hysterical about the racist things Trump says. However I bet most people actually agree with him....
 
Let's be honest, I bet most white people actually prefer living in a white country. 

As I've said before,
Antarctica is waiting for you matelot
[emoji12]

[the village idiot]

4 hours ago, Haironyourchest said:

Yes I understand your viewpoint VI, but I and probably two thirds of the world's population believe it to be wrong and misguided, just as you believe our viewpoint to be wrong. In the long term, that is. Drilling in the gulf will not destroy the environment or the climate. It simply will not. That is what we believe. There is no downside to drilling for oil, anywhere at any time, none whatsoever. We do not believe the media and leftist-government inspired "narrative" of AGW. We just don't buy it. When we run out of crude oil we can start tapping the hydromethane deposits, which currently hold three times more energy than all the known fossil fuel reserves ever discovered. Unlimited growth for centuries is what we expect the future to be. We don't want redistribution of our wealth to the third world, or the lazy in the first world. We want everyone to work and thrive, all the world over. We want strong national identities, all the world over, preferably on friendly terms. That is true diversity, different cultures in different places with strong borders to keep them distinct and seperate. If people want to change cultures, more power to them, but the mixing of cultures in the same place and the resulting conflicting moral and legal norms - we don't want. We just see the nature of man and the world from a different perspective...see, I can sympathise where you're coming from and where the Trump haters are coming from because I was one once. I used to long for global governance, world peace, fairness for all, etc. I've gradually gone over to the other side though. I see Trump as literally the Hail Mary Pass that saved humanity from an eventual communist style world government. Its like the magic eye pictures, reality looks like something, then you adjust your brain a bit, and it suddenly looks like something else...its a funny old life..

 

You're a good sort though, VI, and I believe you feel the same way about Trump as most of my friends, and I'm still friends with most of my friends! - I'm not trying to troll you, I just feel a moral obligation to defend Trump and his agenda from time to time.

Just wrote the longest reply in forum history Hairychest then deleted it as I realised you are right.

 

We see the World differently.

 

I see a marvelous ball of rock and water carrying 8 million species (one of which is particularly complex) hurtling through space, and is best understood through objective science in all it's forms.

 

You see a marvelous world owned by humans to be divided up and used as each group of humans sees fit. You value good science, but don't necessarily accept a broad scientific concensus as the best option available as way forward. Or something relatively close to that?

 

Who has the best viewing platform? Not sure.

 

I don't think I am capable, or willing to zoom in to your particular depth of focus in order to offer up anything mind changing, so I'll revert back to annoying people with silly stories on other threads.

 

I hope I have not misrepresented you too badly. Please correct me if I have ballsed up.

 

Sweet dreams, or hope you're enjoying your toast.  TVI

[difflock]

I attempted to quote "hairy on your chest", but failed.

Anyway to say there is no downside to oil drilling is absolutely wrong, IF one cares about the natural world, in its current state.

That is not attempting to deny that another asteroid could not wipe out 97% of all Earths species,

but why is some of, or unfortunately probably most of, the current human population attempting to destroy the Earth it before the asteroid gets here?

To use the energy they pillage to make shit they dont need, to then dump said shit mere months later causing even more environmental damage, never mind flying to places that they degrade merely by dint of their unneeded presence. 

Essentially Homo Sapiens is a plague upon planet Earth.

Marcus

Edited January 20, 2018 by difflock

[skyhuck]

10 hours ago, Haironyourchest said:

Yes I understand your viewpoint VI, but I and probably two thirds of the world's population believe it to be wrong and misguided, just as you believe our viewpoint to be wrong. In the long term, that is. Drilling in the gulf will not destroy the environment or the climate. It simply will not. That is what we believe. There is no downside to drilling for oil, anywhere at any time, none whatsoever. We do not believe the media and leftist-government inspired "narrative" of AGW. We just don't buy it. When we run out of crude oil we can start tapping the hydromethane deposits, which currently hold three times more energy than all the known fossil fuel reserves ever discovered. Unlimited growth for centuries is what we expect the future to be. We don't want redistribution of our wealth to the third world, or the lazy in the first world. We want everyone to work and thrive, all the world over. We want strong national identities, all the world over, preferably on friendly terms. That is true diversity, different cultures in different places with strong borders to keep them distinct and seperate. If people want to change cultures, more power to them, but the mixing of cultures in the same place and the resulting conflicting moral and legal norms - we don't want. We just see the nature of man and the world from a different perspective...see, I can sympathise where you're coming from and where the Trump haters are coming from because I was one once. I used to long for global governance, world peace, fairness for all, etc. I've gradually gone over to the other side though. I see Trump as literally the Hail Mary Pass that saved humanity from an eventual communist style world government. Its like the magic eye pictures, reality looks like something, then you adjust your brain a bit, and it suddenly looks like something else...its a funny old life..

 

You're a good sort though, VI, and I believe you feel the same way about Trump as most of my friends, and I'm still friends with most of my friends! - I'm not trying to troll you, I just feel a moral obligation to defend Trump and his agenda from time to time.

If only this were true.

 

We have the luxury of being able to kid ourselves that this is true and will die before we are proved wrong, but what about our children and grandchildren?

 

I guess you care not that there is no part of our seas that don't contain plastic and we are now eating plastic in our food?

 

What about air pollution?

 

I used to think very must like you, but really you must have to put so effort into ignoring what all around you these days.

[Mesterh]

53 minutes ago, skyhuck said:

If only this were true.

 

We have the luxury of being able to kid ourselves that this is true and will die before we are proved wrong, but what about our children and grandchildren?

 

I guess you care not that there is no part of our seas that don't contain plastic and we are now eating plastic in our food?

 

What about air pollution?

 

I used to think very must like you, but really you must have to put so effort into ignoring what all around you these days.

Same here.

 

Surly it's not difficult to see that releasing massive amounts of dirty polluting energy that has been locked away for millions of years into the atmosphere and Sea's can't be seen as something that won't have a negative impact on the environment? I know the grammer there isn't the best but im sure the point gives across.

 

I certainly don't want to give up the luxuries we have as it's great to enjoy them and life is short but as skyhuck says none of us well be here to see the problems we are causing, it's probably our grandchildren who will suffer. Unless we do look to limit fossil fuel use but there is no way on earth that will happen since it's a multi trillion dollar business and getting bigger year on year.

 

I suppose it is easier on the conscience to dismiss it all.

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

2 hours ago, difflock said:

To use the energy they pillage to make shit they dont need, to then dump said shit mere months later causing even more Environmental damage, never mind flying to places that they degrade merely by dint  their unneeded presence. 

By 'zooming out' it's possible to view the subject with the necessary focus to rise above the sort of idealistic zeal that exists only within fairy land and the Green Party where moaning and wailing, but never having the realistic prospect of being faced with the responsibility for action, is a luxury that is enthusiastically exploited....

 

Quoted above is (a large part of) the uncomfortable truth - and only by acknowledging it, and some of the perhaps even more uncomfortable realities that it presents can there ever be any form of realistic corrective action.

 

Stop focussing on 'growth' as an economic indicator of 'success.'  

Stop buying / using stuff you don't need.

Stop deluding yourself that flying off to the beach is paradise when in reality it is a "shithole."  (timely intervention by the FCO - https://www.gov.uk/foreign-travel-advice/jamaica)

 

The greatest threat to human existence on this planet is the human population.  It appears to me that the least likely candidates to acknowledge and seek to address this uncomfortable reality are those that are generally to be found within the organisations that do the most wailing.... 

 

[difflock]

Kevin,

A good point, re Government run Ponzi schemes

As a young(ish) man entering the world of employment, some 35 years ago, I was gobsmacked to be told by a retiring accountant type , who was retiring on a fat occupational pension, which he said our generation would never see, because they would become unaffordable for future workers to pay for.

He may have been a generation or so out, with his gloomy prediction, but he was absolutely correct.

He bluntly then enlightened us re pension schemes which relied on fresh incomers paying the retirees benefits , which again, he explained, only worked with ever increasing population and the continuous economic "growth" so created.

Which by any definition can only be unsustainable.

As a bought and paid for small farmers son,  it was very hard to believe that all Governments could be so stupid selfish.

Marcus

Edited January 20, 2018 by difflock

[Sutton]

2 hours ago, skyhuck said:

there is no part of our seas that don't contain plastic and we are now eating plastic in our food?

There is some hope for an ocean plastic cleanup:

 

https://youtu.be/RLAq19hGTBw

[Vespasian]

24 minutes ago, difflock said:

Kevin,

A good point, re Government run Ponzi schemes

As a young(ish) man entering the world of employment, some 35 years ago, I was gobsmacked to be told by a retiring accountant type , who was retiring on a fat occupational pension, which he said our generation would never see, because they would become unaffordable for future workers to pay for.

He may have been a generation or so out, with his gloomy prediction, but he was absolutely correct.

He bluntly then enlightened us re pension schemes which relied on fresh incomers paying the retirees benefits , which again, he explained, only worked with ever increasing population and the continuous economic "growth" so created.

Which by any definition can only be unsustainable.

As a bought and paid for small farmers son,  it was very hard to believe that all Governments could be so stupid selfish.

Marcus

I wonder why politicians bend over backwards to call us all all racist if we question immigration?..

 

Suits the Left because they get cheap votes, suits the right because they get cheap labour.. not to mention, saves the city institutions money on pensions...

 

Couldn't copy Japan could we?...   how come they haven't fallen for the bullshit?...   I wonder if its because they think long term and want Japan to remain Japan, and not some outpost of any dozen shithole countries round the world..

[Haironyourchest]

Having my toast, as it happens. To address the last five or so posts about pollution as a side effect of fossil fuel use: Yes there is some pollution, mostly urban from vehicles. CO2 is not a pollutant, it is a plant food. The global warming scare and the scientific consensus is a swindle, plain and simple. Its the green energy lobby, the tax-happy globalist-leaning governments who want to control the energy sector and therefore the economy. The atmosphere (oh God I'm so tired of this...) - used to contain many hundreds of times the CO2 it does today. The earth was lush, warm and brimming over with life, animal and vegetable. The natural state of the earth is to have no ice at the poles. We are still technically in an ice age. The sahara is greening because of increased CO2. The inject 5 times the atmospheric amount of CO2 into commercial polytunnels to stimulate plant growth. Reducing fossil fuels will wreck economies, and not reverse or halt global warming, if indeed it is happening at all, they lied about the data and tortured statistics, computer models very wrong and have recently admitted it.

 

Heres the thing with the Green Agenda - its government trying to force the economy to go a way it doesn't naturally want to go, with the carrot and stick method of subsidisation and punishment. This is dangerous - its taking peoples freedom away. If the fossil fuels were to start running low for real, the alternative energy sector would suddenly take off like a rocket, driven by real consumer demand for cheaper energy and human innovation stimulated by necessity. But at the moment, crude is the most useful form of energy, its cheap, abundant, stores well, transports well, stable, great energy density etc etc. But trying to force us to abandon it and turn to the more expensive "green" option by coercion, based on a moral narrative that is simply made up......

Edited January 20, 2018 by Haironyourchest