Making the news today....

[the village idiot]

Blaming religion is a futile cause, absolute waste of time, I've no idea why banging on about it makes people think it is the cause of all things bad.

 

No religion = no terrorism?

 

Aye, so it does[emoji849].

 

Mull, If you don't read posts properly then your responses to them will forever continue to make no sense.

[Stumpy Grinder]

I would say that it's certainly a positive development.

 

I don't think there will be much meaningful progress until these Imam's acknowledge the FACT that these terrorist's actions very much DO have something to do with Islam. Until this happens their words won't carry an awful lot of weight with the extremist thinkers and doers. They need to be braver and accept that the terrorist mind set comes directly from a literal interpretation of the very same handbooks they are themselves aligning with.

 

Christians, on the whole, accept that there are parts of the bible that glorify the killing of those who renounce Christian theology, but as a religion they have managed to get to a point where this is pretty much universally agreed to be a non-starter.

 

If Muslims (as a religion) were able to do the same we should be able to make some headway. Effectively classifying the extremists as being of a different faith (which is what the Imam in that article is doing) is not going to help.

 

What we Westerners/Christians/other religions etc cannot comprehend, is that many muslims are 'wired up' completely differently due to their beliefs of the afterlife, so much so, that they quite simply do not fear death a we do. In fact, many of them welcome it as it is viewed as a better life, especially if you enter it through martyrdom. Actually when you look at the restrictions and requirements of the religion as imposed by Sharia Law, I think I would rather be dead too, especially if I was a woman!

When parents can strap their 16 year old daughter to a donkey laden with explosives to suicide bomb a checkpoint? Could we do that with religious or parental justification? Social services would have a field day with you over here!

I've seen Muslim pilots that have come over to train with our military simply let go of the controls when it all got too difficult whilst saying Allah will look after me! Will he look after the non-muslim instructor too!

I very much doubt he will look after either, as both will be dead and simply make their way back into the carbon cycle.

I believe that as we become more educated, religion plays a lesser part of our lives. How many of us now go to church compared to our grandparents? Small villages which now have large populations have rarely used churches which would have contained the entire village every Sunday once.

That said, some of the recent nutters that choose to end their lives as well as others are well educated and 'home grown'! So did they make their own interpretation of the Quran or were they influenced?

I think they were very much influenced, and it is the source of influence that is the key to prevention! These are often educated young people that have been radicalised to a degree that we cannot comprehend. We are talking thousands which are influenced by the few. We know who the 'few' are, so deal with them in an appropriate manner!

ASG

[Mull]

Mull, If you don't read posts properly then your responses to them will forever continue to make no sense.

 

 

I understand you're not blaming religion entirely vi, but to even suggest jihadis or the Ira atrocities were based on their religious beliefs is ludicrous to me.

You do understand that that terrorism has nothing to do with 'religion'?

Nothing!!!

I also understand why you have been sucked in to your understanding of the views you put across.

Edited June 6, 2017 by Mull

[Stumpy Grinder]

I understand you're not blaming religion entirely vi, but to even suggest jihadis or the Ira atrocities were based on their religious beliefs is ludicrous to me.

You do understand that that terrorism has nothing to do with 'religion'?

Nothing!!!

I also understand why you have been sucked in to your understanding of the views you put across.

 

So you believe that religion has no connection to terrorism?

Jihads have no connection to religion?

Whatever!

SG

[the village idiot]

What we Westerners/Christians/other religions etc cannot comprehend, is that many muslims are 'wired up' completely differently due to their beliefs of the afterlife, so much so, that they quite simply do not fear death a we do. In fact, many of them welcome it as it is viewed as a better life, especially if you enter it through martyrdom. Actually when you look at the restrictions and requirements of the religion as imposed by Sharia Law, I think I would rather be dead too, especially if I was a woman!

When parents can strap their 16 year old daughter to a donkey laden with explosives to suicide bomb a checkpoint? Could we do that with religious or parental justification? Social services would have a field day with you over here!

I've seen Muslim pilots that have come over to train with our military simply let go of the controls when it all got too difficult whilst saying Allah will look after me! Will he look after the non-muslim instructor too!

I very much doubt he will look after either, as both will be dead and simply make their way back into the carbon cycle.

I believe that as we become more educated, religion plays a lesser part of our lives. How many of us now go to church compared to our grandparents? Small villages which now have large populations have rarely used churches which would have contained the entire village every Sunday once.

That said, some of the recent nutters that choose to end their lives as well as others are well educated and 'home grown'! So did they make their own interpretation of the Quran or were they influenced?

I think they were very much influenced, and it is the source of influence that is the key to prevention! These are often educated young people that have been radicalised to a degree that we cannot comprehend. We are talking thousands which are influenced by the few. We know who the 'few' are, so deal with them in an appropriate manner!

ASG

 

I think that certainly makes sense as a picture of the problem in the UK and Western Europe. I have always been coming at it from a global, human civilisation scope. Whilst the Koranic texts that inspire these actions are considered valid in their entitity by human beings (whether through their own interpretation or under influence) there is going to be religiously motivated senseless death and destruction.

 

I don't know if this can be irradicated, but if it can, it can only be lastingly achieved through reforming people's faith in bad ideas. I agree that it is very difficult to reach some people. In an ideal world I would argue quite strongly that this philosophy should be extended to the point where all faith based reasoning is replaced with true reason. A lot of the ideals of religion would still exist because they are demonstrably good ideas, but we can jettison the harmful stuff that extends from religious faith if all human morality is debated and determined in the spirit of science and reason.

 

I fully accept that I am a bit of a dreamer, but why not aim for the best possible (intellectually honest) future outcome for everyone?

 

PS. Most of this text is really directed at people with views like Mull. I think Stumpy Grinder and I are pretty much on the same page.

Edited June 7, 2017 by the village idiot

[Mull]

So you believe that religion has no connection to terrorism?

 

Jihads have no connection to religion?

 

Whatever!

 

SG

 

 

Have a wee think about it !

[TIMON]

I would say that it's certainly a positive development.

 

 

 

I don't think there will be much meaningful progress until these Imam's acknowledge the FACT that these terrorist's actions very much DO have something to do with Islam. Until this happens their words won't carry an awful lot of weight with the extremist thinkers and doers. They need to be braver and accept that the terrorist mind set comes directly from a literal interpretation of the very same handbooks they are themselves aligning with.

 

 

 

Christians, on the whole, accept that there are parts of the bible that glorify the killing of those who renounce Christian theology, but as a religion they have managed to get to a point where this is pretty much universally agreed to be a non-starter.

 

 

 

If Muslims (as a religion) were able to do the same we should be able to make some headway. Effectively classifying the extremists as being of a different faith (which is what the Imam in that article is doing) is not going to help.

 

 

Good post. Thought provoking.

(I still don't believe that God enjoyed giving "those" orders in the Bible far less that the Bible "glorifies" them )

It seems like Islam is having a bit of an identity crisis right now...., [emoji106]

 

 

Timon.

[Mesterh]

I understand you're not blaming religion entirely vi, but to even suggest jihadis or the Ira atrocities were based on their religious beliefs is ludicrous to me.

You do understand that that terrorism has nothing to do with 'religion'?

Nothing!!!

I also understand why you have been sucked in to your understanding of the views you put across.

 

 

Go on please explain this theory of yours to me then.

[dan494]

Craziest thing I've ever heard. Shouting this is for Allah and then stabbing innocent people in their face or cutting off their head because they don't believe in your god is not religiously motivated now? That's a bit insulting to the victims

 

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[TreeswingerPerth]

Craziest thing I've ever heard. Shouting this is for Allah and then stabbing innocent people in their face or cutting off their head because they don't believe in your god is not religiously motivated now? That's a bit insulting to the victims

 

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100% agree