Non Payer

[Mick Dempsey]

1 hour ago, Rough Cutter said:

Typical poor job as that's hardly removal.

Not ground out properly and roots and mess left behind.

I wouldn't pay for that either 

Would of probably been a good idea to have it in writing you were only going to skim the stump off a bit for turfing over.

Move on with life and set out in future with customers what exactly you are doing.

 

I agree.

 

[maybelateron]

Slight derail, but not really. Years ago I felled a couple of small trees in an old woman's back garden. Quote made no mention of dealing with stumps in any way. Soon after, she rang me to say one of the stumps had a horrible smell from some decomposing material on top of it, and that she had nearly tripped and broken her neck on the other stump. I politely explained I had fulfilled the terms of my quote, but she kept on hassling me and threatening small claims court etc. This was in 2006, and the invoice for the work had been £50.

I went and looked at things. The offensive "decay" was fox or badger poo; wish it had been on her carpet. The dangerous stump was in the corner of the garden where you would have no reason to be walking, let alone breaking your neck. 

I told her it was not my responsibility to clear up the poo. We went back with the grinder to shut her up, but had fun doing so. Made laminated notices about trip hazards for the steps in her garden etc, and kept knocking on the door to warn her of these hazards. She told the young lad with me she thought I was being silly - you just can't win. I think was a tight old sod who didn't like the look of the stump and wished she'd asked to have it ground out.

From that point on every quote for tree felling from me includes "cutting stump close to ground, or higher if requested on the day". For stump grinding I again specify the depth I will grind to, and that this does not include chasing roots, unless customer wants to pay more for that.

Rant over, but often we learn from these really annoying customers how to prevent a recurrence.

[AHPP]

1 hour ago, maybelateron said:

We went back with the grinder to shut her up, but had fun doing so. Made laminated notices about trip hazards for the steps in her garden etc, and kept knocking on the door to warn her of these hazards.

 

In the nicest possible way, that's pretty crass.

[Old-Oak]

6 hours ago, maybelateron said:

Slight derail, but not really. Years ago I felled a couple of small trees in an old woman's back garden. Quote made no mention of dealing with stumps in any way. Soon after, she rang me to say one of the stumps had a horrible smell from some decomposing material on top of it, and that she had nearly tripped and broken her neck on the other stump. I politely explained I had fulfilled the terms of my quote, but she kept on hassling me and threatening small claims court etc. This was in 2006, and the invoice for the work had been £50.

I went and looked at things. The offensive "decay" was fox or badger poo; wish it had been on her carpet. The dangerous stump was in the corner of the garden where you would have no reason to be walking, let alone breaking your neck. 

I told her it was not my responsibility to clear up the poo. We went back with the grinder to shut her up, but had fun doing so. Made laminated notices about trip hazards for the steps in her garden etc, and kept knocking on the door to warn her of these hazards. She told the young lad with me she thought I was being silly - you just can't win. I think was a tight old sod who didn't like the look of the stump and wished she'd asked to have it ground out.

From that point on every quote for tree felling from me includes "cutting stump close to ground, or higher if requested on the day". For stump grinding I again specify the depth I will grind to, and that this does not include chasing roots, unless customer wants to pay more for that.

Rant over, but often we learn from these really annoying customers how to prevent a recurrence.

Just cant win sometimes! Same here, trees always cut to ground level and customer informed in quote, then if they request higher, their choice. As you can see, this stump is an old stump, so not my work. He was told depth it will be going, and it was for stump only. As for people thinking this stump removal has been left in a mess and hardly a removal, with roots left behind, clearly have more time on their hands and not enough trees to cut. Im a arborist, not a landscaper. With 30 years in this game, and many stumps in them years, never heard such nonsense. Not my job to sieve through it and make it look pretty. Bad payer is a bad payer, and will come up with any old rubbish  just to not pay. I requested to meet him tomorrow, but he declined, saying he wants me to finish the job and has given me 5 day as he's got someone booked in, yet still refuses to send pictures of what he see's as the problem.  Let him crack on now, any fraud who touches this job, because its a "No Job" and wants to say I didnt remove this stump, will be dragged into this case in the court, as I've got before, during and after pictures. Stump removal (Grinding) only! Along side all communication, and him not willing to meet me, or send pictures of what he's disputing. He's told me he will be sending the new contractors invoice to me as he's deducting their charge out of my invoice, so I will get to see whos done this! 

Edited November 23 by Old-Oak

[topchippyles]

14 minutes ago, Old-Oak said:

Just cant win sometimes! Same here, trees always cut to ground level and customer informed in quote, then if they request higher, their choice. As you can see, this stump is an old stump, so not my work. He was told depth it will be going, and it was for stump only. As for people thinking this stump removal has been left in a mess and hardly a removal, with roots left behind, clearly have more time on their hands and not enough trees to cut. Im a arborist, not a landscaper. With 40 years in this game, and many stumps in them years, never heard such nonsense. Not my job to sieve through it and make it look pretty. Bad payer is a bad payer, and will come up with any old shit just to not pay. I requested to meet him tomorrow, but he declined, saying he wants me to finish the job and has given me 5 day as hes got someone booked in, yet still refuses to send pictures of what he see's as the problem.  Let him crack on now, any fraud who touches this job, because its a "No Job" and wants to say I didnt remove this stump, will be dragged into this case in the court, as I've got before, during and after pictures. Stump removal only! Along side all communication, and him not willing to meet me, or send pictures of what hes disputing. He's told me he will be sending the new contractors invoice to me as he's deducting their charge out of my invoice, so I will get to see whos done this! 

I would put him in front of Judge Rinder 😉

Edited November 22 by topchippyles

[Mike Hill]

To be honest you could have made a better job on that stump,he could have been less of a twit.

 

I get a incident like this every now and again. Sometimes it's because I didn't manage expectations, sometimes I didn't do as good a job as I could have,other times the client was a bellend who never intended to pay all along..

 

I am surprised that with your 30 years in the game you simply haven't learned how to deal with people like this?

 

Take the course of least resistance in order for you to get paid. Put this behind you and have a nice Christmas. 

 

On a somewhat similar note,I had a call from a client last night querying my invoice. Instead of me taking the wood away ,her neighbour decided to have it. I declined transporting it 100m to her neighbours for free but we agreed with the client I would cut it up for them onsite.

 

She wanted a discount because " I hadn't bothered to take the wood away".

 

I simply should have changed the written quote to list the new details and had her sign it but I assumed she would be reasonable. 

 

My fault,let's see if she pays.

 

 

[Mick Dempsey]

17 minutes ago, Mike Hill said:

 

 

I get a incident like this every now and again. Sometimes it's because I didn't manage expectations, sometimes I didn't do as good a job as I could have,other times the client was a bellend who never intended to pay all along..

 

 

 

Job recently where the loader broke down and I had to come off and get it fixed.

By the time I got back to it a week or so later I was counting on getting it finished by lunchtime and onto another to make the day financially respectable.

Got it all done, but client wasn’t happy about certain aspects, and tbh he had a point. I blagged it face to face and got the money.

 

I could have done better, it wouldn’t have taken a lot to have made the whole transaction more agreeable, but I was chasing the money and an early cup of tea in my armchair.

 

Sometimes you have to admit that to yourself.

[Clutchy]

Whenever there is an issue like this it is almost always due to a breakdown in communication and original wishes. 

 

If the client told you from the get go that he wanted it ground out to replant, you should of refused the job, as there is no way your pedestrian grinder has ground deep enough. 

 

Or client hasn't told you that, and you can rely on your terms, which I hope we're attached to your quote stating that stump grinding is to 'x' depth unless expressly stated. 

 

Our terms our 150mm which is sweet f all in the scheme of things, but covers me. As a minimum I would still go down to 300mm 

 

If I know someone is looking to replant I will up that to 550mm below grade, charge more and insist that we need to use our large tracked grinder, and tell them to confirm that any alternative quotes are also going to this depth. 

 

2 sides to every story here. 

[oldwoodcutter]

Whenever I see work of that standard, it’s been done on a job I quoted and lost out to the competition.

Often with a fold up grinder in the back of a white escort van that was one of the last off the line at Dagenham, with an unusually large clasp lock on the back doors.

If you’re stump grinding grind it out.

Edited November 27 by oldwoodcutter