Maybe the UK should plant more....

[The avantgardener]

22 minutes ago, Big J said:

They take vast amounts from here, or so I'm lead to believe. Lorries drying past dozens of potential (and willing) customers to take the wood into Kent. Speaking to a haulier a few months back, he said he spent a full week just cross loading processor grade hardwood in the New Forest, all to go to KRE. 1500t just from that site.

They are chipping 800 tonne per day.

[G13469]

19 hours ago, Mr. Ed said:

to vulgarise the discussion, what do they pay for the chip?

Last November euro forest were pay us £30/ton for turkey Oak for chip

[ESS]

22 hours ago, The avantgardener said:

Sussex is one of the most densely wooded Counties in the country, they take lots from here and Kent itself.

It did have the most tree cover in the country pre 87 blow. 

Kemsley papermill at Sittingbourne used to process in excess of 100k tonnes Roundwood per year,  all hand cut,a large percentage of which came from within 100 mile radius of the mill, this was mainly from coppice . There was also an overlap for demand  with St Regis further to the west, the supply chain was there , and still will be. I seem to remember Sandwich were looking for a minimum of 170k tonnes per annum.

I started in the industry in 1975 , imports then were 82%,. How much we import has never just been governed by what we can produce, the biggest factor is exchange rate.

It also has to be considerd that we also export substantial amounts of timber, both as Roundwood and chip.

[The avantgardener]

9 minutes ago, ESS said:

It did have the most tree cover in the country pre 87 blow. 

Kemsley papermill at Sittingbourne used to process in excess of 100k tonnes Roundwood per year,  all hand cut,a large percentage of which came from within 100 mile radius of the mill, this was mainly from coppice . There was also an overlap for demand  with St Regis further to the west, the supply chain was there , and still will be. I seem to remember Sandwich were looking for a minimum of 170k tonnes per annum.

I started in the industry in 1975 , imports then were 82%,. How much we import has never just been governed by what we can produce, the biggest factor is exchange rate.

It also has to be considerd that we also export substantial amounts of timber, both as Roundwood and chip.

We where cutting Ash last week bound for Thailand.

[ESS]

1 minute ago, The avantgardener said:

We where cutting Ash last week bound for Thailand.

Yes, theres a lot been shipped in the last 4 or 5 years, 

[Mr. Ed]

On 11/06/2020 at 20:32, The avantgardener said:

We where cutting Ash last week bound for Thailand.

Gosh that surprises me. For what use? 

[The avantgardener]

6 hours ago, Mr. Ed said:

Gosh that surprises me. For what use? 

Haven’t got a clue. Wouldn’t surprise me if they where making tool handles and shipping them back.

[daltontrees]

This is a lovely informative and thought-provoking thread, and so far free from pathogenic postings. Long may it last.

 

Some random observations.

 

Walnut is a thoroughly antisocial tree, it enforces distancing by being allelopathic, poisoning the roots of anything near it including its own offspring. Granted, if the spacing could be worked out it could be planted in stands but it probably can't be an efficient use of land.

 

Several years ago I got some Leylandii poles I had felled at a job, 40 foot and dead straight. I used it for fence posts, and 15 years on it has barely discoloured. It's an improbable choice for commercial planting but I can see it paying dividends.

 

I have built my office out of Western Red, it has been mostly trouble-free and was a pleasure to work with. Another good candidate if it can be kept fork-free.

 

Personally I dislike monoculture, and when given an opportunity to specify planting I usually alternate and mix to build in resilience and buffers against pathogen spread. I would even admit that it is insurance against poor planting choices too. In controllable urban settings some diversification into non-natives is a good thing provided it can be reversed if it goes badly wrong. What I see often is the inevitable consequences of obligatory mixed native planting, with predictable succession and climaxing interspersed with incompatible runts and failures. Poor choices are very often made.

 

The theory is all well but a recent experience said it all for me, I was to specify replacements for a large housing site where lots of native trees were being removed. The ecologist and I wanted the existing mix to be emulated in the replanting scheme. Meantime the landscape architects, demonstrating a shameful lack of understanding, specified for the same client mostly inappropriate cultivars and species based on their looks. I can guarantee that about 60% won't see out 2 decades and 20% more will be detested by the residents within the same time (because of shading) and that the existent bird population will be entirely and almost permanently displaced. The planning officer was persuaded based on the landscape architect's reputation. So there you have it, the client didn't care, the landscape architect didn't understand and the planner didn't know better and voila another 25 acres of ailing urban sticks, empty planting pits and mullered skyscrapers, lost to nature.

[Khriss]

2 hours ago, daltontrees said:

This is a lovely informative and thought-provoking thread, and so far free from pathogenic postings. Long may it last...... 

Give us a minute! Just got dinner n wine on... Sure some gobshite will wade in soon  ?  K

Edited June 13, 2020 by Khriss
I mean.... Its just like some informative tree website with knowledgable people?? Or is this a rather strong merlot i just been slipped....

[ESS]

Certainly in the case of Walnut I suspect a lot of trial planting would have to be carried out , with a cost attached that I doubt few would want to be burdened with.

From my own experiences down the years there is a high percentage of rot in mature trees, as the butt end is where the value is  this renders the tree worthless. Trees that had a possibility of being sound were grubbed if possible, the figure that is in high demand for gun stocks etc. is in the bottom end of the butt running down into the root.

There seems to be a high percentage of sapwood in certain trees, perhaps this is a strain thing? I have no idea.

As far as planking, who buys solid wood furniture these days?, it would be a very limited market,i suspect the limited availability has contributed to the value of Walnut, not taking anything away from the character of the wood.

Veneer logs need to be blemish free , and would need to be shipped.

Timber in general is a cash crop, past generations grew it for the next generation. The changes in planting through to milling over the past 30-40 years is such that stands of timber are now coming to market as clearfell within 40- 50 years, with very little management after establishment.