Two Rope Working Consultation

[Pete Mctree]

Our only chance is if the industry continues to reject the draft icop & force the AA to re-engage the HSE as they could not proceed with it in its current form.

 

 I predict that the push back from the industry will place them in a difficult position though, as if they do as the HSE want, against the current weight of opinion, then they will cease being the voice of arboriculture in the UK.

[Khriss]

@TIMON is exactly my position. We ARE using it cos there can be no margin of error or grey area , when, god forbid , there is fall followed by a claim and Contract Implications plus insurance payment . ( I personally am appalled as a climber ) K

[Marc Lewis]

Who is going to carry the can if say there is an accident due directly to the inherent dangers of 2 rope working after an employed climber has expressed his concerns with it yet the employer or supervisor has over ruled and said you must use a 2nd line? Seems you could be damned if you do, damned if you don't.

[TIMON]

For example.... a very real risk. Modern friction devices such as the Zigzag and Spiderjack are definitely not suited to having another line in close proximity. A sudden loss of friction/grip on a mainline resulting from contact with the second line could easily have catastrophic consequences.

[Mark Bolam]

Would the HSE prosecute themselves?

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

1 hour ago, Mark Bolam said:

Would the HSE prosecute themselves?

Has been known to happen (investigation rather than prosecution.)  One of the experimental test labs was censured...

 

HSE censures itself for lab burns | IOSH Magazine

WWW.IOSHMAGAZINE.COM

---

The HSE employee was testing a prototype hydrogen storage vessel on 4 October 2016 when the incident happened...

 

 

Edited January 9, 2020 by kevinjohnsonmbe

[jfc]

2 hours ago, Marc Lewis said:

Who is going to carry the can if say there is an accident due directly to the inherent dangers of 2 rope working after an employed climber has expressed his concerns with it yet the employer or supervisor has over ruled and said you must use a 2nd line? Seems you could be damned if you do, damned if you don't.

I guess if this goes ahead and there is an accident caused by 2 ropes and a court case found 2 ropes responsible HSE might have to change the guidance. That process could take years of course.

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

You’d think a simple question like:

 

How many trees have you worked in using a 2 rope 2 TiP system?

 

Posed to the ‘brains’ behind this proposal might be enough to introduce just a smidge of critical analysis into the process...

[Jake Andrews]

I guess if this goes ahead and there is an accident caused by 2 ropes and a court case found 2 ropes responsible HSE might have to change the guidance. That process could take years of course.

It HAS gone ahead.

[Rich Rule]

5 hours ago, Mark Bolam said:

Would the HSE prosecute themselves?

I asked that question about 5 weeks ago.  Expecting an answer is like expecting them to take note of any of this discussion...  it isn’t going to happen!