New laws on woodburners

[Alycidon]

On 23/05/2018 at 14:12, Stumpy Grinder said:

As seen recently in Homebase!

Thats an understatement,  I have measured softwood from them in the past at over 50%.

 

A

[Steven P]

I'm reading this and trying to think of the incentive behind the idea.

 

I reckon that they are picking on wood burning stoves because that is what is being installed these days - not open fires. If city centre flats were being fitted with open fires then the legislation would include them.

 

 

Now here is a thought for the deeply cynical. If you can get those in the cities to only use kiln dried logs.. sold at a premium.. then the tax revenues will increase. You cannot tax a ton of wood that has no financial value (ie the free stuff).. but you can if it is sold as dry hard wood. Now you could take this a step further and say that kiln dried hardwood is a premium product, a luxury perhaps - especially since we all know that air drying overtime can get the same results ... no tax breaks for luxuries are there?

 

 

[Rough Hewn]

Europe is trying to take Britain to court over excessive air pollution.
Think it's called a knee jerk/panic reaction.

[Billhook]

The whole World seems obsessed with the smaller details rather than the bigger picture

Yes , there are arguments about particulates but there seems to be no joined up handwriting.

At the same time as banning some of these lesser pollutants there is far too much air travel and driving around in cars with massively unnecessary horsepower all capable of sub nine seconds to sixty and three figure top speeds.  Unseasonable foods coming in from all over the globe, massive waste of food by selective size, quality and Best before dates.  All costing the environment and natural resources a great deal to grow only to throw away.

But way above all of this is the pollution caused by military training and warfare.  God knows how much energy is consumed every time a Eurofighter is scrambled let alone dropping a bomb in Syria.  Every bomb dropped is probably equivalent to the whole emissions of all vehicles in London for a month.....a year even.

Going back to the question of burning wood, we grow several acres of miscanthus here which has taken the place of coal at Drax power station.  I am sure that there are tons of particulates released each year from this process but we are saving our coal resources.  Will miscanthus be banned as well?

[openspaceman]

58 minutes ago, Billhook said:

The whole World seems obsessed with the smaller details rather than the bigger picture

Yes , there are arguments about particulates but there seems to be no joined up handwriting.

 

Agreed

58 minutes ago, Billhook said:

At the same time as banning some of these lesser pollutants there is far too much air travel and driving around in cars with massively unnecessary horsepower all capable of sub nine seconds to sixty and three figure top speeds.  Unseasonable foods coming in from all over the globe, massive waste of food by selective size, quality and Best before dates.  All costing the environment and natural resources a great deal to grow only to throw away.

Yes we are profligate with fossil food because it is commonly available and as such subject to the tragedy of the commons.

58 minutes ago, Billhook said:

But way above all of this is the pollution caused by military training and warfare.  God knows how much energy is consumed every time a Eurofighter is scrambled let alone dropping a bomb in Syria.  Every bomb dropped is probably equivalent to the whole emissions of all vehicles in London for a month.....a year even.

A few years back I corrected someone about whether volcanos produced more CO2 from  their activity than mankind,s combustion of fuels, they don't. In this case I think you are probably right but if we are talking about particulates, with the exception of fine dusts carried from arid regions, most particulates settle out or are diluted quite quickly, 200metres from a busy road  attenuates exhaust particulates to ordinary background,

 

There is a problem in the above in that we now know it's particlates between 1.5 microns and 2.5 microns that are a bigger problem and they likely travel further, dust is also a lesser toxiity to particles of incomplete combustion.

58 minutes ago, Billhook said:

Going back to the question of burning wood, we grow several acres of miscanthus here which has taken the place of coal at Drax power station.  I am sure that there are tons of particulates released each year from this process but we are saving our coal resources.  Will miscanthus be banned as well?

I would expect the furnaces at Drax to have complete combustion, so no Products of Incomplete Combustion to speak of. PICs are formed when a flame doesn't have time  to complete and the conditions in a large burner have the right time, temperature and turbulence to ensure good combustion. They will aslo have stack filters including electrostatic and wet scrubbers to remove fly ash and heavy metals.

[Billhook]

I think it all depends on the volcano.  Krakatoa sent clouds around the World and there were two or three years without a Summer.

Wait till Yellowstone blows its top!!!

[Mick Dempsey]

This thread has taken Whataboutery to a new level.

[Stubby]

30 minutes ago, Mick Dempsey said:

This thread has taken Whataboutery to a new level.

Whatabouytery  A cracking word .  tis like Yeabut ......

[Mick Dempsey]

18 minutes ago, Stubby said:

Whatabouytery  A cracking word .  tis like Yeabut ......

I think it’s a recent addition, but perfectly cromulent.

Edited May 27, 2018 by Mick Dempsey

[Billhook]

3 hours ago, Stubby said:

Whatabouytery  A cracking word .  tis like Yeabut ......

Whatabouytery sounds like the name of a Polynesian volcano!