COP26

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

5 minutes ago, DanHorrich87 said:

Haha! Now you've proven you've got a hotline through to the greatest most influential publication in the country (not!), is it time to formulate an arb economics and start dictating gov policy? Covertly of course.

Maybe it's just time the 'simple people' took over the world and cast the current 'leaders' into the wilderness....  😆

 

Damn....  I'm creeping ever closer to anarchist tendencies with each post. 😂

 

I LOVE the opening quote he uses though.....  "...Instead of focusing on ‘micro consumerist bollocks’ like ditching our plastic coffee cups, we must challenge the pursuit of wealth and level down, not up..."

 

 

Edited November 9, 2021 by kevinjohnsonmbe

[Squaredy]

1 hour ago, openspaceman said:

Without spending time googling to confirm this but I think the major carbon stores are in the sea as clathrates, in the earth as carbonates (like chalk laid down as skeletal remains of small marine creatures) and in the soil as humus and peat like substances as well as vast remaining stores of fossil fuels.

Yes, the earth is in fact such a good engine for turning Carbon into (ultimately) rock and other solids that it is understood that if we (or some other force) do not intervene, life on earth will finally be wiped out when the carbon dioxide in the atmosphere eventually slips below 10ppm.  At this point photosynthesis becomes impossible and all life will then end as we all depend on photosynthesis.

 

Of course this is not going to happen anytime soon, but this is the really long term prognosis apparently.

 

Please don't mis-interpret my words here to suggest I am a climate change denier - I am not.  I have been following this thread with interest, and I would suggest we should all read David Attenborough's latest book (A Life on Our Planet).  What a good read, and not all doom and gloom either.

[Woodworks]

3 hours ago, Stere said:

 

 

 

I don't  fully get the blind spot many enviromentalists and goverments have with population probably seen as off putting and Authoritarian

 

Think its also linked in with gdp as bigger pop =  bigger gdp.....

 

Wonder how many realize pop has its near doubled since 1975?

 

 

 

 

 

 

The Elephant in the Room - Resilience

WWW.RESILIENCE.ORG

---

Discussion about climate disruption and mass extinction rarely mention human population as a significant factor in...

 

 

 

 

Most countries run in dept. If we have less people earning we have a lower GDP making us less able to pay back all our depts.

 

Dept forces us into an endless growth spiral

 

I also suspect its why no government tries to sort the housing price crisis. By keeping housing expensive we are forced into hyper productivity just to own a home. This keeps GDP up to pay our vast depts.

 

Guess many of us would ease off the gas if not being throttled by the cost of mortgages. 

 

Edited November 9, 2021 by Woodworks

[devon TWiG]

Does anyone even know what COP stands for ??  ( conference of parties to save you looking !!)...many ideas floating on here , and elsewhere no doubt ...but little things will be of no use I think , perhaps we will have to give up things like flying unless for important reasons , minimal holidays ,no  golf trips to the Algarve , Skiing ,Stag nights in Amsterdam , watching cricket ,rugby F1 etc in far flung places , Disney world  ....perhaps we  should ban any new larger than needed cars .. sorts cars ,4x4 unless business , VW vans for leisure use , no big tv's , no new larger than needed houses or other status symbol type excesses , I have always had motorbikes should I give them up?  I ride mostly for fun , therefore just wasting fuel , but what would happen to the economy ...motorcycle dealers close down , no mechanics etc ? same for Pilots of planes  and the Aviation industry ?   Who will make such self sacrifices for the greater good ?? or will there be a clumsy set of rules imposed upon us ?  No  one will like it ,and will the rich / celebrities give up all their excesses as good role models ...then what will we do with our money , what incentive will there be to get out of bed in the morning ? I think everyone realises something needs to be done , but who does what , and to what extent ?

[Mick Dempsey]

4 minutes ago, devon TWiG said:

Does anyone even know what COP stands for ??  ( conference of parties to save you looking !!)...many ideas floating on here , and elsewhere no doubt ...but little things will be of no use I think , perhaps we will have to give up things like flying unless for important reasons , minimal holidays ,no  golf trips to the Algarve , Skiing ,Stag nights in Amsterdam , watching cricket ,rugby F1 etc in far flung places , Disney world  ....perhaps we  should ban any new larger than needed cars .. sorts cars ,4x4 unless business , VW vans for leisure use , no big tv's , no new larger than needed houses or other status symbol type excesses , I have always had motorbikes should I give them up?  I ride mostly for fun , therefore just wasting fuel , but what would happen to the economy ...motorcycle dealers close down , no mechanics etc ? same for Pilots of planes  and the Aviation industry ?   Who will make such self sacrifices for the greater good ?? or will there be a clumsy set of rules imposed upon us ?  No  one will like it ,and will the rich / celebrities give up all their excesses as good role models ...then what will we do with our money , what incentive will there be to get out of bed in the morning ? I think everyone realises something needs to be done , but who does what , and to what extent ?

Maybe cut down on the question marks to save the planet? They won’t last forever. What will our children say when there’s none left?

Edited November 9, 2021 by Mick Dempsey

[devon TWiG]

2 minutes ago, Mick Dempsey said:

Maybe cut down on the question marks to save the planet? They won’t last forever. What will our children say when there’s none left?

sorry ....I assumed there were loads left !  

[Mick Dempsey]

1 minute ago, devon TWiG said:

sorry ....I assumed there were loads left !  

There’s the problem! We all do, but when they’re gone they’re gone like the Great Auk.

[Squaredy]

1 hour ago, devon TWiG said:

Does anyone even know what COP stands for ??  ( conference of parties to save you looking !!)...many ideas floating on here , and elsewhere no doubt ...but little things will be of no use I think , perhaps we will have to give up things like flying unless for important reasons , minimal holidays ,no  golf trips to the Algarve , Skiing ,Stag nights in Amsterdam , watching cricket ,rugby F1 etc in far flung places , Disney world  ....perhaps we  should ban any new larger than needed cars .. sorts cars ,4x4 unless business , VW vans for leisure use , no big tv's , no new larger than needed houses or other status symbol type excesses , I have always had motorbikes should I give them up?  I ride mostly for fun , therefore just wasting fuel , but what would happen to the economy ...motorcycle dealers close down , no mechanics etc ? same for Pilots of planes  and the Aviation industry ?   Who will make such self sacrifices for the greater good ?? or will there be a clumsy set of rules imposed upon us ?  No  one will like it ,and will the rich / celebrities give up all their excesses as good role models ...then what will we do with our money , what incentive will there be to get out of bed in the morning ? I think everyone realises something needs to be done , but who does what , and to what extent ?

One significant change would be if governments around the world simply committed to stop subsidising polluting activities.  For example energy production is often subsidised.  If aviation fuel were taxed to the extent it should be (i.e. to pay for the damage it causes) flying would be more expensive so we would fly less. 

 

Same with petrol and diesel.  Why is car ownership so wide and why are so many cars so large and powerful?  Because so many people can afford them.  I have no problem with fancy cars but a heavily polluting car should be made to pay the full price of the pollution.  The principle is simple - polluter pays.

 

Even more clear with meat.  Beef production is very heavily subsidised,  Remove the subsidy and tax beef to reflect the damage beef farming causes and it becomes a nice luxury not an everyday staple.  If we ate beef no more than once a week there would be a vast reduction in greenhouse gas emissions according to the scientists.

 

For various reasons we have developed complex systems of subsidy and support for many very harmful practices.  What we need to do is rapidly change this so we subsidise sound practises.

[Richard 1234]

4 minutes ago, Squaredy said:

One significant change would be if governments around the world simply committed to stop subsidising polluting activities.  For example energy production is often subsidised.  If aviation fuel were taxed to the extent it should be (i.e. to pay for the damage it causes) flying would be more expensive so we would fly less. 

 

Same with petrol and diesel.  Why is car ownership so wide and why are so many cars so large and powerful?  Because so many people can afford them.  I have no problem with fancy cars but a heavily polluting car should be made to pay the full price of the pollution.  The principle is simple - polluter pays.

 

Even more clear with meat.  Beef production is very heavily subsidised,  Remove the subsidy and tax beef to reflect the damage beef farming causes and it becomes a nice luxury not an everyday staple.  If we ate beef no more than once a week there would be a vast reduction in greenhouse gas emissions according to the scientists.

 

For various reasons we have developed complex systems of subsidy and support for many very harmful practices.  What we need to do is rapidly change this so we subsidise sound practises.

That won’t happen it’s political suicide.

too add to it the UK is producing very little these days in comparison to the rest of the world.

China isn’t going to stop India isn’t going to stop.

we go carbon zero is like using a pipette to stop a house burning down

Edited November 9, 2021 by Richard 1234

[Squaredy]

5 minutes ago, Richard 1234 said:

That won’t happen it’s political suicide.

Yeah.  We need some seriously brave leadership.