Subcontractor damage

[Silver Back]

So, I use a subcontractor his standard is very good, and I've put him though pretty much all of his tickets, he also gets his own work - not a problem.  I trust him to do a good job and leave him to it.  As with most Arbs they don't like being questioned.  All fair enough.

The question I have is about a broken gravestone, in my opinion it's the guy who does the cutting that is generally responsible for his actions?

It gets slightly more complicated as the guy doing the lowering, is a young lad.  I had previously lowered another using a 3:1 system and raising the branch maintaining control, used the lad to be eyes as it wasn't that easy to see Arb cutting etc. 

Looking at the broken gravestone (1896!) Arb took 3:1 system out, expected lad to drop it at the right time, doing his own thing,  I was chipping some stuff as I don't want to be constantly questioning what said Arb, or other competent Arbs do.

Who is liable?

I do have insurances, his opinion (and no apology) is that it's my business I have to take it on the chin. 

Over to the floor

[Khriss]

Might have to swallow that.  Def have word with verger , old stones do fracture, if family not around anymore and not an issue. But don't hide it.  As yr the gaffer on site ultimately it's down to you. Oh signer of ye method statements. K

[dig-dug-dan]

3 minutes ago, Khriss said:

Might have to swallow that.  Def have word with verger , old stones do fracture, if family not around anymore and not an issue. But don't hide it.  As yr the gaffer on site ultimately it's down to you. Oh signer of ye method statements. K

If he is a subcontractor, then it's down to him to pay, unless you employ him under your insurance 

[Khriss]

@dig-dug-dan  when I have subbed in, if I broke it, I paid fr it ! But maybe not the case here dependent on views of those involved.  K

[Mick Dempsey]

Is the lowering lad yours or his?

Edited August 3, 2020 by Mick Dempsey

[eggsarascal]

You bend it, you mend it in my eyes. Was the job subbed out, or were you getting freelance labour in to help?

[Will C]

The question is were you or the Subbie “running the site” ?
 

if your paying the bills, collecting the cheque and on site the insurance company will say you are.

If you say to the subbie “thats the job crack on, however you see fit” And leave them to it. They are then running the site as a bonafida sub contractor and it is then there problem insurance wise.  Apart from the customer will claim against you and you inturn claim against them.

 

thats how it was explained to me, I will happily stand corrected.

[Steve Bullman]

Think you’ll probably find it’s your liability by law....morally speaking though is another matter 

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

2 hours ago, Silver Back said:

So, I use a subcontractor his standard is very good, and I've put him though pretty much all of his tickets, he also gets his own work - not a problem. 

 

So, You've trained him and (I'm guessing because it sounds most likely but not exactly clear from what you've written) that you are on the job AND you supplied the ground worker on the lowering rope?  It actually sounds like he might better be classified as a part time employee rather than a Subby but it's clear what you're trying to achieve...

 

2 hours ago, Silver Back said:

 

 

I trust him to do a good job and leave him to it.  As with most Arbs they don't like being questioned.  All fair enough.

The question I have is about a broken gravestone, in my opinion it's the guy who does the cutting that is generally responsible for his actions?

 

He's responsible for the cut but not what happens to it when it starts to dangle from the rope - that's on the guy holding the rope.  Is the guy holding the rope part of the Subby's team or part of yours?  Maybe if it was cut and drop then the climber would rightly be held more 'responsible' (I say responsible rather than liable on purpose) for where the lump goes.

 

2 hours ago, Silver Back said:

It gets slightly more complicated as the guy doing the lowering, is a young lad. 

 

Yours or the Subby's?

 

I had previously lowered another using a 3:1 system and raising the branch maintaining control, used the lad to be eyes as it wasn't that easy to see Arb cutting etc. 

 

So YOU needed a second set of eyes when you were doing the lowering but then left the 'young lad' on his own to  crack on as HE saw fit?

 

 

2 hours ago, Silver Back said:

 

 

 

I was chipping some stuff as I don't want to be constantly questioning what said Arb, or other competent Arbs do.

Who is liable?

I do have insurances, his opinion (and no apology) is that it's my business I have to take it on the chin. 

Over to the floor

I don't mean to come across as harsh (it happens whether I mean it or not - the intent is only to present the type of questions you would have to answer if it had been a warm body rather than a headstone), it's YOUR job, it's YOUR customer, it's YOUR look-out!

 

Question - is your climber or you ticketed for CS 40/41 (in old speak) or not?

 

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

1 hour ago, eggsarascal said:

You bend it, you mend it in my eyes. Was the job subbed out, or were you getting freelance labour in to help?

Who bent it though Oeuf brouillé?

 

The climber,  the guy holding the rope or the gaffer that didn't have supervision of the job?