Have the definitive regulations regarding firewood?

[Steven P]

Reading this a couple of comments... 

Weight and m3... 1 'log' from a pine tree weighs less than a 'log' from an oak tree. A hardwood log (say Oak) can weigh more than a hardwood log (say Cherry). A log that has say outside in the sun all summer or in a nice kiln will weigh less than a log from a freshly cut tree in the spring. Similarly a log from a freshly felled tree in winter will weigh less than the same brand of tree felled at Easter. It is very variable. A volume of logs is perhaps easier to quantify but even then it is very variable but you can be more sure of the quantity that you will get. Quality is a different matter, a 'ton' of hardwood could be a ton of polar or a ton of oak and the measured volume can be different between suppliers, here market forces come into play, get a short load of poplar logs and you aren't going to go back there again.

 

Oh, John, Electricians, as far as the regs go you don't need to registered with an organisation to do any work, just need to be competent but what that is I am not sure, you can get one who is registered to certify any works (if they will do that)

 

 

Now woodsure scheme.. yeah we can talk our way around avoiding the requirements but if they don't like you then no matter what you do they will get you for not stumping up the cash - split loads, paying for delivery of free logs, or paying someone to split them on site (not always possible of course). Enforcement is likely to be along the lines of trading standards that they will act if they get a couple of complaints but not till then and rely on 'random' inspections and a fear factor to ensure compliance... but would that replace the system we have now of market forces - sell someone a wet load of wood and they will think twice about coming back for more.

 

My view of the scheme is that its intentions is OK, we all burn dry wood, but they have taken the easy way out rather then the hard way of making sure the wood is dry when it goes on the fire, now being dry when it is sold (so I can tip it uncovered on the drive in November and burn it at Easter and that is OK). Even better it is those who already are governed by market forces that will pay the money, those that have a business because they do sell good quality and dry firewood. Me who gets the occasional windfall supply, selling a car boot full at a time to whoever turns up for a couple of hundred in a good year will never even consider registering... and it the gumtree and facebook advertisers who are more likely to sell wetter wood.

 

Eventually I think it will expand to try to catch anyone who processes their own firewood but that is on the edge of the 'too hard' pile and might not happen for small households but if you have a large requirement and produce your own for that they might come chasing in a few years

[Justme]

If the wood is all at the same % moisture then kWh per kg is almost the same for all wood types.

 

It should not be hard to calc a price per kWh & then adjust for %moisture x by actual weight sold.

 

But what a pain weighing it all & getting an average % for each load to work out the price.

 

Cant see Joe public being happy with being told your delivery will cost between X & Y & you wont know till its loaded.

[john87]

See, the top and bottom of it is, the whole entire idiot scheme was dreamt up, not even by people with good intentions, but by people purely motivated by greed..

 

john..

[Steven P]

3 hours ago, Justme said:

If the wood is all at the same % moisture then kWh per kg is almost the same for all wood types.

 

It should not be hard to calc a price per kWh & then adjust for %moisture x by actual weight sold.

 

But what a pain weighing it all & getting an average % for each load to work out the price.

 

This is true, but most true that it is a pain and a pain costs time and then money. Imagine a busy yard - or maybe not that busy I don't know - has to get 10 loads of wood delivered on a Monday morning, you'd be having to sample several logs from each, record the results and work out the average to get a good representation of what the wood moisture percent actualy is, and 10 times over, and then load up and weigh what is gong out, calculate the energy and then the bill (though a spreadsheet can do the calculation and invoice easy enough) before a truck leaves the yard. Yu'd need to sell by the kWH and educate all the customers that that is how they are paying for it,

[Justme]

Yup total pain the the butt.

 

Loose tipped volume just seems the easiest way. 

[Steven P]

14 hours ago, Justme said:

Yup total pain the the butt.

 

Loose tipped volume just seems the easiest way. 

Would tend to agree with that especially since the processing costs are not by the kWH, or any other complicated calculation. It costs the mostly same to cut, split, and dry a pine log as it does an oak log, makes sense to sell in unit of what you actually create. Market forces dictate that hardwoods are at a premium - supply and demand and all that.

[Justme]

4 hours ago, Steven P said:

Would tend to agree with that especially since the processing costs are not by the kWH, or any other complicated calculation. It costs the mostly same to cut, split, and dry a pine log as it does an oak log, makes sense to sell in unit of what you actually create. Market forces dictate that hardwoods are at a premium - supply and demand and all that.

Inputs would cost more on oak & take much longer to dry.

Possible slightly more cost to process too.

 

But then hardwoods tend to get sold for more to cover that.

 

 

[Stubby]

4 hours ago, Steven P said:

Would tend to agree with that especially since the processing costs are not by the kWH, or any other complicated calculation. It costs the mostly same to cut, split, and dry a pine log as it does an oak log, makes sense to sell in unit of what you actually create. Market forces dictate that hardwoods are at a premium - supply and demand and all that.

I would give oak 2-3 years and pine 2-3 months for a given ideal conditions .

[Steven P]

... didn't say drying... but you get my point that the cost to process a 'log' is pretty much the same regardless what that log is... granted drying time is a factor, but the unit you are producing is a log, not a kwh, makes sense to sell it by the unit you produce

[devonbrion1998]

Well I have gone and submitted my Woodsure application,not totally happy with paying out

but reckon its only fair on folk that have made the effort to do things right,and |I dont really want to be on the wrong side of the regs.

Anyone know what to expect when they come out to do the audit?I have a couple of smallish barns 5m x 14m

stack the logs on pallets,sheds are covered on three sides and open fronted,with the poss of a drop down gale breaker during the winter.

Thing is there pretty much empty this time of year,normally fill up in the spring and summer,so not much to see,