Self Employment Pay

[Treespasser]

Hi all,

 

I just wanted to post a thread to get others' opinions on this topic, as I'm sure there's variation out there.

I've been a sub contracting climber for 8 years now (and consultant for a short while) here in the UK and have never come to a conclusion.

 

As a self employed climber or groundsman charging 'X' amount as a day rate, you'd obviously get X for the standard 8/9 hours worked that day.

But what if you work 4/5 hours... would you still expect your day rate?

For instance, if you worked hard and got the job done in good time.

(I know this depends on circumstance, such as if my employers job got cancelled last minute, I would not expect X amount if a replacement job couldn't be found)

 

My current main employer normally lays another job on us if we get the main job done in good time, squeezing the most out of us. (This aggravates the sh*t out of me)

 

But also, if you're a self employed consultant working for larger companies, say you book the day off to do a survey they asked you to do and it takes you 2 hours to do the inspection and 1 hour to type it up. Do you charge 3 hours and lose the rest of the day... or charge the whole day because you booked it out for that survey? This happens to me quite a lot.

 

All constructive comments welcome and look forward to reading what other subbies and employers do.

 

Cheers!

 

[Chris at eden]

37 minutes ago, Treespasser said:

Hi all,

 

I just wanted to post a thread to get others' opinions on this topic, as I'm sure there's variation out there.

I've been a sub contracting climber for 8 years now (and consultant for a short while) here in the UK and have never come to a conclusion.

 

As a self employed climber or groundsman charging 'X' amount as a day rate, you'd obviously get X for the standard 8/9 hours worked that day.

But what if you work 4/5 hours... would you still expect your day rate?

For instance, if you worked hard and got the job done in good time.

(I know this depends on circumstance, such as if my employers job got cancelled last minute, I would not expect X amount if a replacement job couldn't be found)

 

My current main employer normally lays another job on us if we get the main job done in good time, squeezing the most out of us. (This aggravates the sh*t out of me)

I used to be in the same situation during the 90's when climbing.  Swings and roundabouts he used to say, even resorted to get us painting his fences sometimes.  In the end we stopped rushing to get the jobs done and just did them in the time we had been allotted.  Pretty annoying.   

37 minutes ago, Treespasser said:

 

But also, if you're a self employed consultant working for larger companies, say you book the day off to do a survey they asked you to do and it takes you 2 hours to do the inspection and 1 hour to type it up. Do you charge 3 hours and lose the rest of the day... or charge the whole day because you booked it out for that survey? This happens to me quite a lot.

When use a subbey I agree a fee upfront (usually a day rate) with them and then pay them that amount.  If they get it done quick the day is theirs.  Problem is, they can tend to rush it and send it back with loads of typos!  Annoying from the other perspective, you cant win. 

 

What sort of consultancy do you do?   

37 minutes ago, Treespasser said:

 

All constructive comments welcome and look forward to reading what other subbies and employers do.

 

Cheers!

 

 

[Treespasser]

Thanks for the reply Chris.

49 minutes ago, Chris at eden said:

When use a subbey I agree a fee upfront (usually a day rate) with them and then pay them that amount.  If they get it done quick the day is theirs.  Problem is, they can tend to rush it and send it back with loads of typos!  Annoying from the other perspective, you cant win.

That's an ideal way to do it I think, and yes in many ways you can't win.

I tend not to rush jobs because of the inherent risk of an accident anyway, but I have been doing what you mentioned... just padding out the day to get the job done in the time stipulated. 

 

I only do tree condition/risk assessments. 

[lux]

Hi all,
 
I just wanted to post a thread to get others' opinions on this topic, as I'm sure there's variation out there.
I've been a sub contracting climber for 8 years now (and consultant for a short while) here in the UK and have never come to a conclusion.
 
As a self employed climber or groundsman charging 'X' amount as a day rate, you'd obviously get X for the standard 8/9 hours worked that day.
But what if you work 4/5 hours... would you still expect your day rate?
For instance, if you worked hard and got the job done in good time.
(I know this depends on circumstance, such as if my employers job got cancelled last minute, I would not expect X amount if a replacement job couldn't be found)
 
My current main employer normally lays another job on us if we get the main job done in good time, squeezing the most out of us. (This aggravates the sh*t out of me)
 
But also, if you're a self employed consultant working for larger companies, say you book the day off to do a survey they asked you to do and it takes you 2 hours to do the inspection and 1 hour to type it up. Do you charge 3 hours and lose the rest of the day... or charge the whole day because you booked it out for that survey? This happens to me quite a lot.
 
All constructive comments welcome and look forward to reading what other subbies and employers do.
 
Cheers!
 

Haven’t you answered your own question. If you sub contract yourself at a day rate surely you can’t expect the main contractor not to use you all day. Good business sense from him.
If you work harder than normal to get the job done quickly it’s as if it was price work not day rate. You either need to slow down and stop knackering yourself or have a pre agreed set of rates for hours / half days etc. If you put yourself out there on day rate don’t expect not to be used for a day.
It’s a bit different if it’s the job is finished maybe an hour earlier than expected. It would then be unreasonable to push on to another.
I would say switch to price work for your consultation stuff. It will most likely work out better for you and the client.

[benedmonds]

50 minutes ago, Treespasser said:

 I have been doing what you mentioned... just padding out the day to get the job done in the time stipulated. 

Not the best way to impress your employer.. 

[spuddog0507]

Well there is times in life when  you really need to keep things to yourself, and this is one of them, the way you have worded it and as i understand it, you want a full days pay for half a days work ! you say that you get a job done and then the boss puts another job on as there is time left in the day to do it, and the aggrivates the shit out of you, your words , i dont see any thing wrong with that at all, a days paid work is a days paid work, or have things changed ! what you say in your post that tells me as an employer you dont want to do the extra job, but yet you still want paying ?, thinking forward and how many other people are reading this and are thinking the same ! i dont think you have done yourself any favours here, Good luck but shoot self in foot comes to mind,,,,

[Mark Bolam]

I can see both sides to it.

I used to work for a bloke who would reward us for smashing a job out quickly (so he had made what he wanted to make on a one day job plus our wages) with hours of logging until 5pm.

That used to grind after a bit.

If we worked till 8pm to finish a job because of his shit pricing we didn’t get any extra.

 

It’s swings and roundabouts, and I like to think I treat people a bit more fairly than that.

[Khriss]

If i price a job an the lads do well. I dont care when they leave that nice tidy site. If they dont cut to my spec' or i get a complaint. It may be other guys i use next. They are plenty of subbie blokes. I dont expect blokes to work well fr shit money. But i expect a good job done. K

[Khriss]

@Treespasser as surveyors, i would be wary of rushing thru a survey in case i missed something. There is always extra to put in it. But hey, maybe yr man is doing you a favour so you can nip round corner fr an extra job, dunno? Depends on yr relationship with him.  K

[gdh]

If you're on a day rate and it's not regular I think it's fair to get a full day if you finish an hour or two early but equally you shouldn't then expect more pay if you have to do another couple of hours to finish the job.

 

If you're able to get all your work done in half days consistently I would personally be asking for more work each day, hopefully it would prove your value and lead to more work/money in the future.