Should a referendum on Scottish independence only include people living in Scotland?

[Johnsond]

1 hour ago, agrimog said:

Big J, I believe you are refering to the Darrien  Gap  fiasco in your quote, yes it nearly bankruptred scotland and was one of the factors leading to the union of parliaments, but as the union was never properly implemented, the terms werent followed as it was written and the whole thing wasdone to benifit england, its a bit one sided, how about when england was bankrupt and sold out the entire populaton on the international stock exchange of the time~(this is the reason birth certifcates were introduced, selling the entire population of the country into servitude) , nothing said about this, or the fact that scotland is the olny member of the union with a positive GDP, and actually sends more money south than it gets back despite what the media might want you to think......and as for our "shared debt" why should we pay for crossrail and the hst, it doesnt benifit scotland, actually it doesnt benifit most of england....omly the tory rich home counties, Ive done my reseach and looked at both sides and as I said all we've ever been is a cash cow, a sorce of cannon fodder for the military , and a place for rich aristocracy to have hunting estates, displacing thousands off the land......bring on independanceand all the benifits it will bring     saor alba

Worked with a guy whom quoted all the similar kind of stuff you are and was like a rabid dog at the last indyref . He ended up getting sacked due to his inability to come to terms with the result of the referendum. Kept quoting historical stuff as you are from hundreds of years ago etc etc etc. Conspiracy theories about Westminster and how Scottish oil at 120 usd a barrel would make us rich etc etc basically caused a pile of confrontation on site to such an extent his position became untenable. As I’ve said before and J  alludes to if they want independence then show they can govern well first and stop blaming everyone and everything for all the messed up policies and socialist crap they are trying to implement. The past is the past me I’d rather look forward than hundreds of years ago to aid my decision making process. One thing I do get sick of even though I’ve lived and worked up here most of my life and am married to a Scot with kids born here etc etc is the never ending anti English rhetoric from people like yourself stoked  up by that shit stirring incompetent  bugger sturgeon. I’m originally from the north east of England and let me assure you that area has not had it easy for a long long time. 

[David Cropper]

48 minutes ago, Johnsond said:

Worked with a guy whom quoted all the similar kind of stuff you are and was like a rabid dog at the last indyref . He ended up getting sacked due to his inability to come to terms with the result of the referendum. Kept quoting historical stuff as you are from hundreds of years ago etc etc etc. Conspiracy theories about Westminster and how Scottish oil at 120 usd a barrel would make us rich etc etc basically caused a pile of confrontation on site to such an extent his position became untenable. As I’ve said before and J  alludes to if they want independence then show they can govern well first and stop blaming everyone and everything for all the messed up policies and socialist crap they are trying to implement. The past is the past me I’d rather look forward than hundreds of years ago to aid my decision making process. One thing I do get sick of even though I’ve lived and worked up here most of my life and am married to a Scot with kids born here etc etc is the never ending anti English rhetoric from people like yourself stoked  up by that shit stirring incompetent  bugger sturgeon. I’m originally from the north east of England and let me assure you that area has not had it easy for a long long time. 

Totally agree mate. Well put. 

[jfc]

Something I feel should have been applied to the brexit vots as well as indyref2 is that to change things there should be a 55%+ majority. Or even 60%. Being 50% means the losing side can justifiably block progress as they are representing the near 50% who didn't support it.

[Baldbloke]

so, your willing to sucombe to the constant barage of lies and deceit we, as a nation has been fed for the last 300 years, or since the farsical so called union of parliaments, the first of the lies....the "great " union has only ever had one use for scotland, as a source of easy taxation  and to prop up the sweet homeland that surounds london, we are the only country in the world which has oil reserves, and food banks and child poverty, most of the oil revenue went into proping up the city of london and the home conties.....what did scotland get in return, to be guinea pigs for the poll tax,  come the elections on the 12thdec, we shall see what the feelings of the people of scotland are, till then its only theorys and polls, and funny how england has supported every other member of the great british comenwealth who saught independance, except for one, its cash cow
 

[Baldbloke]

Is that the India we've just given £98m in foreign aid to?

With its own space program too

[trigger_andy]

43 minutes ago, jfc said:

Something I feel should have been applied to the brexit vots as well as indyref2 is that to change things there should be a 55%+ majority. Or even 60%. Being 50% means the losing side can justifiably block progress as they are representing the near 50% who didn't support it.

But that is not how the democratic process works is it? It would put to much of a slant on remaining in the status quo. How could you justify a situation where a majority of the UK or Scotland make a decision and its not honoured? 

[Baldbloke]

.

[emoji1303]

 

Or where Scotland earlier voted on remaining as part of the U.K. and then wants dispensation over remaining as an EU member. This when the U.K. (as a whole) decided it was a crap idea. [emoji848]

[jfc]

But that is not how the democratic process works is it? It would put to much of a slant on remaining in the status quo. How could you justify a situation where a majority of the UK or Scotland make a decision and its not honoured? 

Well surely brexit has shown what a total f. up the current system is.

[agrimog]

the system is so corrupt that the whole lot needs binning.....an absolute farsical procedure votes bought and sold, and more lies than a story telling contest, its time every voting card had a last line entry  "none of the above", and if it scored more than 30% of the vote, every candidate  booted out and a fresh round with new people tried again, oh and as a question to all you folk that think we as a country get subsdised from the rest.........some hard and proven figures please, not ones dreamed up by political parties or mass media

 

[Big J]

12 minutes ago, agrimog said:

the system is so corrupt that the whole lot needs binning.....an absolute farsical procedure votes bought and sold, and more lies than a story telling contest, its time every voting card had a last line entry  "none of the above", and if it scored more than 30% of the vote, every candidate  booted out and a fresh round with new people tried again, oh and as a question to all you folk that think we as a country get subsdised from the rest.........some hard and proven figures please, not ones dreamed up by political parties or mass media

 

Government Expenditure and Revenue in Scotland (GERS): 2018 to 2019 - gov.scot

WWW.GOV.SCOT

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GERS estimates the contribution of revenue raised in Scotland toward goods and services.

 

 

Every single table shows that proportionally, Scotland receives higher spending that it takes in tax. If by every available measure, Scotland is sustaining itself less adequately than the rest of the UK, who exactly is picking up the bill for that overspend? 

 

It would be much better for the Indy camp to just accept that Scotland has a dependency and lack of self sufficiency issue, and work to fix that before proposing Independence again. Much is made of the wealth of revenue that could potentially from come renewables, as well as the much lauded North Sea oil fields. But when it comes to the figures, Scotland has less than 10% of the UK's population and over 50% of the budgetary deficit.