agg221

Are you a dwarf? Are you a masochist? If the answer is no to both of the above then believe me, people are doing you a favour by -not- giving you an Allen Scythe. Geoff gave me his Allen Scythe, and I use it, but I am a masochist. Alec

An aside, but this seems like an appropriate thread: We have bought the field next to us, which adjoins roads on two sides and has lines running along the edge (I think they are phone lines as they are only single line - I will be checking this before doing anything) I want to hedge it properly but would ideally leave some standards in along the length. Is there anything fundamentally stopping me from doing this, particularly if they are phone lines - the thinking is to run them up high enough to the crown that there are no side branches until clear above the lines. Alec

Sadly my apprentice (different industry) left a few weeks back. Nothing we did, or could have done - he always wanted to join the Navy but they turned him down on eyesight grounds, but suddenly decided to make him an offer which he understandably took. There are several factors which are important I think, most of which have been covered by Andy, Amy and Felixthelogchopper - mutual respect probably being the key one (I have seen a lot of engineering doctorate students whose first aim is to leave their placement, rather than get a job there at the end, on account of the treatment they have received, then talking to the employer they make negative comments about the commitment of the student). One additional point though - this is a stage where people are finding out what they want to do with their lives. Some have a burning desire to do something, only to try it and find they don't like it. Others drift into something and find it is really for them and stay forever. Then there are the ones who really don't have a clue and were never going to get there anyway. It is very hard to pick the winners out early. One thing we have done is to talk to the local colleges early (about this time of year) and allow people to apply - then down-select the ones who are promising for interview and offer a small number a week's work experience, following which they can decide if it is for them. This has helped weed out a few who really weren't up to it or interested enough, and a couple who thought it was what they wanted and found it wasn't. Alec

Hi David, This would be a consequence of my suggested approach, but not the objective. The foliage looks to be a good colour, with good sized leaves. Although the exposed area within the carpark is small, it is comparable to the canopy and although it has been compressed by cars driving over it etc I am presuming (and I acknowledge this to be a presumption) that the desire lines will be more likely to be over the hard standing, for both car and foot traffic, so the damage may not be that great. The above suggests to me that the tree is not in need of desperately urgent intervention to prevent imminent death. As such, cardboard mulch to suppress the weeds and encourage the worms to improve the soil structure would probably be sufficient to keep the root system going. Again, counter to 'arb' practice, I might be inclined to apply some general purpose balanced fertiliser - Growmore or blood, fish and bone at about 4oz (one good handful) per square yard. This is because extension growth is not fantastic and being a fruiting tree will have taken specific elements out of the soil in a way that a non-fruiting tree won't. This variety has not developed through natural selection - it will have been specifically selected to produce heavy, reliable crops of much larger fruit than the original wild form, ie the fruit mass will be significantly higher, so will deplete the soil of specific nutrients much more rapidly as a consequence. There are three zones of foliage growth to consider - suckers from the roots, low level epicormic growth on the trunk and 'top growth' above the clear trunk height. I would definitely remove the suckers because, unlike a seed-grown tree, they are not genetically the same. 'Free stock' (ie seedling grown, for pear or coincidentally crab for apples) were grown by planting out rows of seeds and selecting the vigorous seedlings, whereas selections for fruit tend to be weaker. As such, the suckers, if left, will out-complete the existing tree which may accelerate its demise, with consequent loss of habitat etc. I acknowledge that a very thorough management programme of keeping them cut out before they reach a certain size could work but I suspect it is more likely they will get out of hand, leading to a twiggy mess and a dead stump. It would also, in theory, be possible to select one to develop as a replacement trunk, but this would defeat the object in my view (see end). Epicormic on the trunk - fairly harmless but has a tendency to get rather dense if all left - being under the canopy its natural growth will be straight up, which will lead to a dense mass of weakly attached material on a compromised base - which loses first, the attachment or the whole lot? Top growth - I would treat as above. This is a tree which, in its prime, would have been quite capable of reaching 40' in height. Keeping it down to 15-20' will keep it vigorous enough and match the available root zone to the canopy. The overriding premise though is that the management of fruit trees -as- fruit trees had advantages in preserving them. It's rather like pollarding at Burnham Beeches or in the Basque, in that the tree is not a natural form but the management technique used has created a specific environment and the coincidental effect of keeping the main structure going indefinitely - certainly much longer than a maiden form would. I will take some photos tomorrow at Mum's place of some heavily compromised apples on Paradise stock, which passed their commercial life over 60yrs ago and yet with regular management should outlive me. Treating fruit trees as such is also part of the cultural reason for the tree to 'be'. There are other management techniques which may work equally well, but I prefer to avoid them as they don't fit with the tree's purpose. Sorry, not much about mulching in there. I'll take some nice pictures of mulching too! Alec

I wouldn't claim anything like David's level of knowledge, but do have some knowledge of aged fruit trees. It's hard to get an absolute sense of scale on that, but it looks to be about a foot to 15" across? The leaves around the base look like pear - this would put it on pear rootstock, which used to be the norm for standard grown trees (6' of clear trunk before the branches). Coincidentally, these want removing on a regular basis as they are not the same variety as the tree itself - break them out with the 'heel' if you can (a sharp knock downwards), otherwise cut them off as low as possible, preferably underground. I use a mattock for this. If it is on pear stock and around 15" across then it is probably around 100yrs old, depending on growing conditions locally. It may well be a perry variety. I would be inclined to keep a clear trunk to a height, to keep it looking like a fruit tree - probably somewhere between 4' and 6'. Despite the damage, growth looks pretty good, so I would look to keep and develop a framework of branches, spaced evenly round the tree to avoid imbalance, and kept well thinned out to avoid wind resistance. I would then let laterals grow off the framework branches and cut some of these back each year, to the lowest side-branch (closest to the framework branch) or if nothing is available then cut well back to encourage lower growth and cut out the following year. I wouldn't worry too much about small pruning wounds - the structural wood is gone anyway, so I would use drop-crotch pruning where necessary to keep the structure small. The above is a method known as renewal pruning and can keep aged fruit trees going indefinitely. It keeps them very thin and making regular growth, so they don't build up wind resistance and maintain some vigour. It has quite a lot in common with 'proper' old fashioned pollarding in that respect. With regard to the mulch, I would be inclined to rake it aside and stick some cardboard down first if you can, then put the mulch back. Cardboard suppresses the weeds, mulch keeps the moisture in and stops the cardboard blowing away. Also the worms eat the glue and help aerate the soil in the process. Alec

Several possible reasons spring to mind: someone can't count, someone measured around the bar and didn't realise that you need the slight play to get the chain over the sprocket, or it could be that they were made up for an older model with an outboard clutch, which can change the location of the bar mount relative to the axis of the sprocket (on a long bar, a chain which runs at midpoint on the tensioner on an 070 is too slack to run on an 076 for example). Either way, Rob has the solution! Alec

I was going to ask about that - excellent news as there is a real shortage of good habitat for owls nests. Alec

2ft is an excellent size - 2ft-2ft6 is my preferred diameter. Big enough for a good yield without curving off too much at the top, but small enough that you can move the bits. Much bigger than that and I would quarter if for preference. Alec

I don't actually use either of these - the mill pushes the sawdust out of the way and I haven't yet milled where I have had to worry about sawdust clearup. Alec

The combined list suggested looks good. If you are ordering several ripping chains, I suggest you get an Oregon and a Granberg for the 36" bar as a starter and compare them. You can then decide on what you like going forward. The 47" bar that the saw comes with is hard nosed. This isn't ideal for milling, although it isn't impossible. They seem to work better with older, low revs/high torque saws. If you find you enjoy it you will probably do better to stick with the 36" bar for now and buy a long sprocket-nosed bar at some point. I also suggest having an axe, a small chainsaw, a mallet and chisel and a claw hammer to hand - the first two are to address sticking out bits and areas which are just too wide to get the mill through, the rest is to deal with metalwork. Alec

I have a beam which needs to have a plate inserted in it. The beam is box heart. Box heart tends to open up round in a wedge, ie you cut a slot but the top gets wider than the bottom. If you don't let it, splits develop somewhere else (it would be different if it was fully seasoned). I cut the slot as early as possible, as narrow as possible, let the thing open up, which with a deep cut in like this makes seasoning much quicker, and when I am ready to insert the plate I will also add a wedge, and plane the sides up to square again. The beam has developed no splits anywhere else. Alec

The dead one is indicative - particularly worth keeping an eye out for dying ones in hedgerows in the area as that way the odds of a beetle missing out one particular tree are pretty small. Softwood and hardwood. When a shoot is growing, it starts off soft and then hardens, usually going from green to typical bark colour in the process. Softwood cuttings are taken before the shoots harden, hardwood afterwards. Some species root more easily when the stem is still immature, others (usually the difficult species) root so slowly that they rely on the 'stick' to survive for a long time, in which instance hardwood cuttings often work better. Sometimes the 'heel' (bit where it breaks away from the main stem) is easier to get to disrupt the cells to form roots but with elm I haven't found much difference. I have a similar plan to you - I am propagating away and will plant as many trees over about a 10 mile area as I can find homes for. My aim is to get a high enough concentration of surviving trees that they are within pollination distance to create a self-sustaining population which will then hopefully spread wider. It won't be timber for me, but some of it may be good timber for someone and I like the trees anyway, despite the old rhyme: Elm hateth man and waiteth... Alec

Yes, it's elm. If others in the area typically die off as soon as they reach around 5" or so diameter then there is a reasonable chance these ones are resilient (some are). Supposedly the best way to do cuttings from elm is to take softwood cuttings in the last week of June, take the lower leaves off, cut the upper leaves to about half their length, use hormone rooting compound and pot them in a 50:50 potting compost:sharp sand mix, keep moist and bag up in a clear plastic bag. Once the leaves naturally drop, take the bag off and then any which leaf out next spring are OK. In practice, I have had a very poor success rate with the above on elm (I am propagating the survivors in this area, of which I know of 10 big trees) and have had much more luck with hardwood cuttings taken just as the buds start to swell, ie you have just missed it for this year. Procedure is otherwise as above, but not worrying about the plastic bag. Alec

How much could you sell it for relative to what you are being offered it for? You need a certain amount of cash 'float' available - for fixing the landy etc (face it, it's a landy, it -will- break down!) but beyond that, any spare cash is earning you nothing sat in the bank, so if you have opportunities to make it work harder for you they can often be worth taking. If you could sell it and pretty much get your money back with only a minimal loss at worst, and you can think of ways in which you could either market the capability, or likely scenarios where you will be asked alongside what you are currently doing, it may well be worth the investment. Only other thing is, assuming it's secondhand, do you know what you are looking at well enough to know that you are not buying a dog? If so, great, if not, is there anyone else you can ask who would know what they are looking at and can offer impartial advice? Alec

I've got a couple that fit this description. One is about 52", the other about 20", both hard nose. Not quite sure of the era but I would guess late '70s/early '80s as the paint is orange rather than red. Alec

That's interesting - I've always thought of silverleaf being the greatest risk when trees are dormant (hence plums & cherries only pruned when growth starts) and the least risk June to Sept as the fruiting bodies appear in about September and stop producing spores around June. My understanding was also that silverleaf particularly likes damp conditions, hence June-July being particularly good for avoiding it, if we actually get a summer. Alec

How long since it was last run, and how old is the petrol? Mine won't start on old petrol - it will run OK once it gets going though. Alec

3" and 4" are handy to have in small quantities, but not the usual thickness for most things in their own right. 24" x 24" is a big section to keep at only 8' long - do you have any particular plans for it? It would take about 20yrs to air dry through. As has been said, I would mill to finished size. You can re-saw, but you have more risk of warping and surface checking in the larger section which can seriously reduce yield. Alec

Entirely agree on the fact that a bandsaw would be the appropriate way to do this job, but one observation - I normally mill the first cut "+1 board" so that I can be sure not the hit the screws, then flip the section over and take the board off. That way, I don't risk hitting metal but get the maximum yield with no extra depth adjustment. Alec

I wasn't twisting your words - I quoted you in full in a previous post and I believe I took the essence of your meaning in my post. I think I fully understand your point of view, I just happen to disagree with it. From my perspective, as an authorised dealer, you are the public face of the brand. Alongside the privileges that brings come certain obligations. This is the whole supposed point of a dealer network rather than an open market. When a customer buys the brand's product, and it goes wrong, they feel aggrieved (understandably, who is going to be happy with a faulty product which is costing them time, money and inconvenience?) At that point, it is -your- fault because you are face they can talk to and it really doesn't matter where they bought it. You represent the brand and how you respond to them colours their opinion of the brand going forward. It's a close equivalent to the person who works in a call centre and has to deal with people who have been passed through endless options and kept on hold for 20mins - it's not the fault of the person you eventually get through to but understandably by that point the customer is frustrated and you are on the receiving end. If you are polite, non-committal about the cause until identified but listen to their opinion and don't presume it's their fault, ultimately react in a timely fashion then you reinforce their view of the brand as professional and offering good service. If you take a negative attitude then it harms the brand - 'their dealers are useless, they just can't be bothered'. Don't get the impression that I don't understand that it is frustrating, but in my view, delivering service with a smile is part of the deal which any authorised dealer (voluntarily) signed up to and it is wrong to accept the advantages without accepting the costs. No, it doesn't pay, but it's part of the price. Alternatively, would you too prefer the arrangement where there is no such thing as an authorised dealer so that you don't have to meet this obligation, but in exchange you would then be in free competition? I know I would. Alec

Barrie, it's not often that I disagree with you, but I do over this one. I honestly think it would be better if the whole concept of authorised dealerships for chainsaws was scrapped. It appears to be a mechanism of sale which is now obsolete but is being propped up by contorted efforts to preserve convention. Think about it, what does an authorised dealer actually do (across the board)? Understand the products - no, keep all necessary spares - no, offer convenience - no, provide a rapid and efficient repair service - absolutely not (see earlier comments about warranty repairs going to the back of the queue, an attitude which I find disgraceful in a customer facing business btw). The dealer does not, in reality, offer an advantage over a truly free market for chainsaws, brushcutters, hedge trimmers etc. As products, they are not exactly complicated. Think how many people buy them from B&Q each year and do not kill themselves or anyone else. There is a sensible way to operate them, and many home users may not follow this in full, but the accident statistics are surprisingly small. So how would the world look if every business which wanted to could buy from the main manufacturer, but with a minimum annual order value for simplicity for the manufacturer (who is not trying to become the customer facing end) and the price included a portion which covered operation of a central repair facility. Machine fails under warranty, customer takes it, or posts it, back to vendor, who forwards to the central facility. This is how Dyson, Hotpoint and many other consumer end manufacturers work, often with items which cost the same or more. I could then order at the lowest price I could find, online at my convenience, or go in person to a shop and do a deal, depending on what I felt like. In what way do I, the customer, lose by this? Continuing to offer a repair service then becomes a straight commercial decision. If you can charge enough to make it worthwhile, do it. Otherwise, no obligations. I think it is telling that, throughout this and every other related thread, the dealers defend protectionist policy but the customers don't like it. Ultimately, this suggests that the least protectionist supplier will be the one which is listening to its customers and is likely to be rewarded with market share. Alec

Selling is a customer facing activity. There are two ways to get repeat custom - a positive experience for the customer or a monopoly. The sentiment expressed above suggests that you may prefer the latter - it should perhaps not be much of a surprise that customers, on the whole, do not, and are therefore unlikely to believe that you intend to offer good customer service. As such, perhaps it is wise not to disclose which 'dealership' you represent. Alec

A lot of the speed comes down to the set-up, and also not underestimating the time spent moving big, heavy bits of timber. For contrast: Tree 1. In December Burrell and I milled a 4' x 20' oak in the most awkward position imaginable, involving wooden fencing, chainlink fencing, berberis and a collapsed deck it had landed on. Milling spec was through and through on the top 10', into a mix of 3" and 2.5" with a 4" thrown in (legs). The bottom 10' was quartered and milled into 2.5". We arrived on site late due to bad traffic and started at 10am. We finished at 5pm, having kept two other people fully occupied with stacking all day but the organisation and forward planning was spot-on, with a really helpful customer and other pair of hands (who is the member on here who arranged the job). Tree 2. Almost identical sized tree but clear, perfect access. Arrived on site at 9am and it should have been easy. It wasn't - the owner was disorganised. The other pair of hands suddenly wasn't available but we couldn't re-schedule so that left us doing the stacking as well (5 man-hours lost), the owner didn't have a clear spec. in mind so we were constantly fiddling around re-setting depths while he changed his mind. Also, for some reason he had only sent pictures of the tree from the 'nice' side and neglected to take any photos of the huge lightning strike down the other side, which the tree was laying on, leading to various rot damage through the structure of the tree which we had to try and cut around and he also neglected to mention the large amounts of nails and wire in the downward side (which would have been much easier to remove before he had the tree felled, so I had to jack the thing up in the air to get them out. The timber was also very stressed and 'grabby' so it kept pinching the bar, and the Ripsaw bandmill was unusable. He also wanted the very large offcuts removed to the edge of his lawn (another 2 man-hours) and was then somewhat put out when we didn't finish milling everything. We left it fully broken down into quarters, with about 60% of it milled, the widest cut remaining to be made being around 20". He carried on and milled it with a friend, taking another two days, but failed to grasp that this is -not- how long it would have taken with a bigger saw. Anyway, point is, things are very variable in milling and it can sometimes take forever, sometimes be really quick, but a lot of it depends on the organisation around the job. It's also important to have the right additional gear for the size of butt you want to tackle. If you're working alone, 2' is a good upper size. 2 people with the right kit can handle stuff up to around 4' but will really struggle to move full width boards. Bigger than that and you need lots of hands or access for loading gear. Alec

Yes, quite a lot of people on here have them. Try searching for the milling pics and vids thread for some idea of what they can do. The 076 will comfortably pull a 48" bar so it's worth looking at the 36" or 48" mill. Chainsawbars.co.uk is a good source (run by Rob D on here) and quoting arbtalk will get you a free gift when you order. Alec

I suggest dropping David Humphries a PM - having seen some of his posts of pictures where he's explaining what's going on to the local schoolchildren, he probably has a good idea what grabs their attention! If you can get a decently secure low barrier fence then taking along as many big shiny toys as possible and being prepared to explain what they are for would be good. If you can get a good lump on site (piece of scrap poplar/willow, say 6-8' long x 18" diameter, pinned to a 4' square piece of 0.5" plywood as a baseplate?), standing upright then demonstrating coronet cuts and bat-slots and explaining their wildlife potential could be good. At the end, as Felix says, you can then fell it! Alec