Dilz

I was speaking to someone today and SRT in trees came up - He ket saying about people not knowing the dangers of it but didnt really say what the dangers exactly are.... apart from taking a fall on a static line i've been thinking and i have a few - but wondering if any people have their own thoughts. SO - my thoughts. -Increased load on the anchor point when using a base tie (though the to what extent is the load reduced by using multiple anchor points, anchor point diameter?? and that having the rope run over multiple anchors some one mitigates the risk if one fails. - Extra tension in the rope - making it more more susectible to be being severed if cut and / or failing if damaged - Base tie can leave a rope running down the side of tree - potential for large limbs or pieces bouncing and damaging the rope. (I should mention of a risk of the groundy cutting the rope or the climber cutting the standing part of the rope - but then this says alot about the quality of the groundsman being used and the lack of situational awareness of the climber rather than a fault with the system - also if cutting a second attachement point / strop should be in place. - If using a fully static rope then increased risk of spinal injury if slack is the system and a fall occurs. (my argument against is - best climbing practices, and that many ropes used in SRT in trees are also used for DdRT) -Climbing to close to you top anchor and forgetting to undo the HAAS and getting the whole thing jammed up and dangling about like a lemon for 10 minutes trying to sort it out The only other danger i can think of is that its made it less likely i will quit climbing anytime soon and do something sensible. and thats all I have given my limited knowledge and experience in SRT anyone got anything thay would like to add?

Neck bungee or chester harnes for advancing the rope wrench system? currently on a chester myself - mixed feelings about it. Would love a system that didnt need either or them.

SO i have the Rockexotica Transporter - Its a nice bit of kit, had it for a few months now - however, certain times I like to hook my chainsaws via the front handle so the blade is horizontal and not hanging down (e.g when sorting out rigging lines, or walking on the ground or using a bigger saw in the tree) Before I used a large caritool and this hooked them easily, and the samll caritool could as well but they snap far too easily. I havent had chance to see a DMM Vault yet but i was wondering if anyone who knows what I'm on about and who has one knows if it will take a saw on the front handle.

Dont want to derail this too much - but today i had a really congested beech tree that had been topped years ago to thin - i could barely climb up in it it was so congested - yet i still did the majority of the climb SRT - the rope wrench set up works ok as a DdRT system even with the wrench still attached although its not perfect - I climbed up using that and my strop then set in a top anchor for SRT then worked off that. Though SRT isn't for all situations and it is a lot a faffing about in the beginning - its not reliant on getting that perfect shot with a throw bag nor is it limited to big trees - I find its really good in congested trees as it doesn't matter that the rope runs over lots of branches and redirects make life easier (if you get em in the right place) - thus it saves me energy. I also have 5m side strop with a pinto which gets used as a short DdRT line a fair amount. on a different note - had an 20 year old apprentice lad with the company who I was subbing to working with me today - had to laugh as he took 40minutes to climb and take the top off a birch tree I would have done in less than 5 minutes -and the first thing he did was cut his finger with the silky - but we all started somewhere (and the job was by the hour)

I prefer waterproof over ventilated - however - nothing wrong with putting in some sort of ventilation that could then be zipped closed to make it water proof?

a healthy addiction to painkillers and planning on moving someplace that doesn't need a staircase. Also smashing a job out in front of the young guns to show em how its done, bollock em for not moving fast enough and then trying not to start limping until they are looking the other way and using SRT as much as possible.

I think somewhere it says climbing equipment should be stored away from direct sunlight and where it isnt at risk of getting any chemicals / fuel spilt on it. Perhaps it was on the NPTC climbing test i did many moons ago. Many different ways to store gear and a lot depends on what you do - When i was doing some line clearance work we had to carry our kit a fair few kilometers in a week so a big portage style rucksack with good padded shoulders was the best. I quite like holdalls because it can be easier to find wht you want instead of pulling everything out of the rucksack - and the lid has a net pocket which is nice for keeping small bits together- a mate used an old suitcase for his kit. I currently have so much gear that I have my large portage bag, with two smaller backpacks stuffed in - and a hold all... the only thing my portage bag is missing is a decent sized side pocket to keep extra things in - you can clip gear to the outside but i dont like this as it can get caught on stuff - but then having the option to clip gear on the outside of the pack is also good.

SRT -Rope Wrench setup. Climbing Line - Cougar blue, Hitch Cord - Ocean Polyester 10mm eye to eye Hitch used - VT

Good video - kind of echos my own situation back neck elbows shoulders and knees have all given me issues - i spent a fortune on physio although i found Intramuscular stimulation (they stick big needles in you) really helped my shoulders and neck - only really got into SRT this last year but will use it as much as possible - and it has really helped - Its funny as i notice how on big days the lads climbing on DdRT tend to fall asleep the moment they are in the van and not so with people who have spent the day on SRT - It helps to get a good shot in with a throwline sure - but with the rope wrench you can just take it off and switch straight to DdRT or even climb DdRT with the wrench attached. I still use DdRT - especially for take because if i'm on spikes - i'm happy stomping around the tree I think having a system rigged for rescue on the ground is actually really good - THere are many different ways of doing it - but i cant see why some people think having a system that is rigged to belay the climber out of the tree is a bad idea - and deffinately far from pathetic - I used an I.D on basal tie to belay out and person who passed out in a tree not that long ago - THere are risks with having a base-tie in sure - but no one system is perfect. People say its a risk because you sometimes cant see the line, or its at risk of being cut by a groundy orthe climber by falling pieces hitting the stem - I have climbed exclusively on base-ties and not once had an issue with anything like this - possibly because i use SRT just for pruning. - an SRT isnt limited to just big leggy trees - far from it - a 15m multi stem Chestnut today - clearing a street light and reducing large limbs growing out over the road - busy crown - would have been fighting with a DdRT system or having to change my anchor point at least once to get to the second part of the tree - not so with SRT - as the best thing about SRT for me is the ease of using a range of redirect techniques and never having an issue of increased friction - Im not going to say SRT is for everyone - it feels strange and awkward at first - it takes practice - a few Rec climbs then making the commitment to using it at work and it feels very gear intensive and needs a bit more investment than a few meters of cord and a pulley wheel - sometimes its best to keep it simple and stick with DdRT - but i can see SRT really helping me - and by the way I mostly work as a subcontractor - climbing for other companies so yeah I still have to keep up the pace - and without many free days in the rest of the calendar this year it would appear i still do. but each to their own.

Another vote for cougar blue - ordered from Nod - it squared off a bit in the beginning but seems to have stopped that now - its a really nice rope for SRT - hardly any bounce to it. Use it with RW and OP-VT for SRT as well as Lock jack for DdRT, and its nice to grab hold of.

short is - im getting fed up of having to ball at either groundies and climbers. I was on a gig where we used hand held radios and it was much more professional than shouting down from 25m. Had a quick look at some of the professional arb sets and they arent cheap - was wondering if anyone has any budget friendly options?

SRT has been about for ages in tree climbing - though mainly purely as access - it was and still is very popular among the scientific community conducting canopy research. For me the big game changer was the introduction of the Rope wrench and then other devices that allowed a RAD's (rapid ascent and descent system) that was effective enough on the ascent to be used in tree work without having to change things over and worked well enough for branch walking - I think it has really kicked off now at least here in the south of sweden - a company i was working with had a split of 2 climbers on DdRT and 3 including myself using SRT as much as possible (though i will was DdRT still has its place)

should have thought of that as it makes sense - still 14 years of saying double rope technique is going to take some time to alter in the grey matter - but i'm looking forward to a new official clarification in terminology that is applicable not just to arb but across industries.

Ha i just came to have a look on the forum and ask for clarification on if it is single rope or stationary rope technique - looks like its not 100% certain yet. I had an issue when working ona project with guy with an IRATA background - when i mentioned Double RT he seemed to thing that it meant the same as using two lines in rope access - so i started using the terms Stationary rope and Dynamic rope technique. I cant see how workign of SRT is any different from the standard Ddrt - in that there is only one rope - if it gets or you anchor fails not to worry as the ground will stop you - but the momment ay work is carried out then a secondary anchor needs to be applied (i.e side strop) The only real issue i find is with using a base anchor where by activity carried out by others other than the climber can result in a rope breakage - potentially at a time when the climber isnt stropped in - when i spoke to an IRATA worker about using two ropes all the time his explination was mainly about how you have a half a dozen other idiots hanging up there with you - some of them using cutting tools and high pressure jet washers so there is much higher chance of one of your ropes being cut. but essentially one rope attahcnment is fine for access / positioning - when working a second rope attachment is needed regardless of the system being used. I think this survery and project is a great idea as it looks like SRT or what ever you want to call it - is here to stay in the arb industry and i for one applaud that as it has made my life easier and i reckon iäll get a few more years out of shoulders yet becasue of it - and that guide lines and legislation need to kept up to date with the industry.

The fact that you can take the ISA theory exams at remote testing centers for me is great, and being able to self study as i could never make it to regular clasess of any sort due to contracting all over the place. I already held an ND in forestry and Arb which is level 3 and found the ISA Cert arb to be of similiar level on theory so feel it should be level 3. The questions on safety though all refered to the american and canadian standards. I did the cert about 6 years after my ND so for me it was a greaat refresher and I the commitment to gaining CEU's encourages to keep up with modern research and methods. ALthough based in Sweden i'm looking forward to what the future holds regarding the co-operation between the AA and ISA. MY ISA Cert has opened up new doors and gained me work even though its a lower level in the uk than my ND - internationally it is well looked upon. Also does anyone know at what level the other certifications are rated at in the UK - I plan to sit the BCMA exam at some point over the next couple of years.

I bought a catch for the Pantin from gustharts - solves the issue - I use a hand ascender and krab to make an advantage system that i can pull myself back in on if going out on a limb, or i look to see if i can redirect further out above - or use my lanyard as a DRT system - or just jump off the branch and take a swing... I think Boots sell some stuff that will be good for your hands - ManUpCream i think its called - Serious note though, i stick to slightly thicker ropes - 11.7 -12mm is my preferred - thin stuff like blaze is too skinny for my big paws. Also gloves help if you dont mind getting them jammed in your hitch.

Agree with the Rec climbing and the vids - lets you try new things without the time pressure - but once familiar with basic set ups start using at work - that really pushed me on - ive only been using it a few weeks at work but use it as much as apossible and its made a huge difference! It feels very awkward at first - can be a lot of faff to set up IMOP - and it feels really awkward at first - but then when you realize you have just climbed 40ft straight up and it just feels like you have walked a flight of stairs I found that once i got a few of the basics principles sorted the biggest issue was then streamlining my kit to reduce faffing about time to make it more useful at work - I bought a seperate rope for SRT set up that has the rope wrench and hitch tied on (i use a LJ on DRT) and it also has all the other bits and bobs attached to it - I also recommend a HAAS / knee ascender - pricey but more than worth it. - Get good with a throw line as well! I use a longer lanyard with SRT than DRT as i can use this as a Short DRT system to help to get up to set my top anchor is i haven't already got it One tip is that at first it can be difficult to get off the ground - not enough weight in the rope to pull it through the ascenders which gets annoying - Simple sollutions to this are tie a hank of rope so it hangs off the ground - or I sometimes use a spare throwbag that has a loop tied onit that i can attach it to the rope as a prussik - then if i pull the rope up at some point i just take it off. Also i think the best bit of advice I got was this ' Redirects - SRT in Trees is all about the Redirects!' Also stick with it - it feels wrong, weird and awkward its by no means a quicker way of climbing - but the amount of effort it saves is astonishing.

I can see an advantage only if you want to potentially reduce the risk of damage to the bark / rope or if there isnt a decent crotch where you want it - (and have the cambium saver wraped on itself so it didnt slip). I cant think of a tree i have done with SRT that only needed the one redirect (maybe only one at a time but it needed moving to work) Midline retrievable anchors are the way forward IMOP - can use the IMP or i find it works well with an anchor ring, a bit of string and a small Krab, - But still the rope guide mod looks cool.

Yeah i ordered from tree worker (didnt want to say so until they shipped my rope out! ) looking forward to trying it out.

Yeah ive noticed the rope does stretch a fair bit - im using tachyon at the mo and so far only done SRT with a base tie - its weird an slightly uncomfortable feeling - and you can physically see the rope stretch, so dont jump into it as amuch as i would DRT - sometimes use my side strop to 'lower' my self into the main climbing line after sorting a redirect - and its that kind of thing that makes me feel that SRT is much slower than what im used to - but it will come with time i guess

I agree in that we should follow the best practices as much as possible, i also agree the life isnt like a text book and sometimes you have to risk a bit more slack here, a angle f more than 45 degrees there, a bit of a free climb and a singing of the 'climbing above my anchor point song'. I just felt from my limited experience of SRT that the slack occuring was a bit more often - mainly if im close to the main stem as i find clipping in a ascending the line i just bump into everything so prefer to climb the tree. - I guess i should just use my side strop set up as a small climbing line if i do this - be nice if the customers paid by the hour... but that is really no excuse - rushing to get a job done - as we all know that is when bad stuff happens. The stiching on the snake anchor is rated to 5kn and is designed to help absorb the shock of an anchor point failing - how effective it is i dont know - and be interesting the see how the rest of my gear and my spine held up to that kind of abuse

TOday i went out with a mate to rec climb just to practice SRT - Now im rather new to SRT especially for moving around the canopy - I found myself climbing the tree a lot more like i would free climbing this meant that at certain moments - usually the most tricky there would be some slack in the line as a climbed up or back in from a limb walk - not much but still enough to make me think if i fall on this its going to put a lot of force on both my back and my anchor point - and this got me wondering if any one has ever installed some kind of shock absorber into their srt system?

Well i've ordered 60m of Cougar blue - mainly as i have never had a blue rope before - which is as good as reason as any to go for the blue.

finally got to the last page - lots of interesting stuff, IM giving SRT with the rope wrench another go after using it maybe twice a few years on RW ZK1 and so i thought id add my two bits and I totally agree - looking at the prussik, split stiff tether, hitch climber set up on a bulky mongoose krab, it looked a mess! i like my lock jack, nice and simple, tidy. i ve bought the ZK2, and today i used it at work for the first time on a not massive but big enough pine tree. After the complete faff of setting everything up, i walked up the rope with ease using a HAAS and Pantin - great stuff - cleared some storm damage on the way. Groundy ran off for another **** as he ate a dodgy takeaway last night so it meant i had to keep my base anchor but pulled out a sling and a krab and advanced myself to my final tie in - this was one thing that annoyed me - on DRT i would have chucked my rope up higher but with the SRT and the way i was doing it it was climb up as far as i could on my strop and then reach up and use the sling and krab to advance the main rope so as high as i could reach. to be fair i had to do this twice and if i wasnt so gash with a throw bag i might not have needed to do it all.. but still it felt slow - and would be a problem if the tree wasnt something that i could basically free climb. I find with the ZK2 wrench that it was a pain pulling slack through to advance the line, i also found it pain to pull slack through when i was limb walking having set up an advantage to pull myself back in - the wrench was just reluctant to disengage - at least with the zk1 i know you can adjust it for different rope diameters and thus make it a bit slicker if needed - but i done think you can do it with the ZK2 - is probably awesome on 11mm lines - but i prefer a slightly thicker rope. - but the limb walk felt awkward and that i was having to fight to get the extra slack i wanted. I miss the fine adjustment i can do with my lock jack or hitch climber on DRT - perhaps i need a slightly less grubby bit of cord.. I found i climbed the tree more and just took up slack as i went rather than climbing n the rope more, if you know what i mean... I think i'll have a dedicated rope bag for SRT already set up to save messing about - and for anything i can get a decent shot in with a throw line its going to get used, but this whole limb walking on SRT, i aint so convinced..

Also wondering if it milks at all - i'm planning on ordering at least a 60m rope for a project this summer where it will be for long ascent SRT work - but 60m will be too much for most stuff after the summer so was thinking of hacking a 20m rope out of it so thought i might order it with two splices..