Making the news today....

[Inoff the Red]

On 12/06/2018 at 08:04, Chessa said:

Meaningful for South Korea, North Korea, Japan and China foremost. The South Korean president did the groundwork (a groundie, who co-planted a tree?). Trump is from a big ol’ battered tree (USA), also within the world’s forest. The current American President may think he can be a climber, but I think he is belaying...(Asia?).

If Obama had arranged the meeting with Kim Yung he would have been given the nobel Peace Prize by now and had the worlds media sucking up to him even more than they used to. 

[difflock]

Well Obama was certainly more personable and plausible, and indeed a better politician, but was he any more persuasive?, other than to his fans

so that lot aint worth a real-world shit,

& the crack about the Nobel Peace Prize was 100% correct btw.

mth

Edited June 16, 2018 by difflock

[Vespasian]

Has Trump achieved anything on his trip?..  I usually follow news like this carefully, didn't bother with this one as I knew it would all be hot air at the end of the day...

 

Up to now I hear Trump and Kim will carry on a dialogue going forward.....   Trump reminds me of Tommy Robinson in some ways..  He wants to do something about a problem, but can't figure a way forward without tripping over himself doing it..

 

Like Tommy Robinson, Trump had better learn to take note of good advice going forward and attempt to understand why that advice is worth taking on board..

 

Going all the way out there to have a photo op isn't the best use of a Presidents time...   

Edited June 16, 2018 by Vespasian

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

20 minutes ago, difflock said:

more personable and plausible

 

indeed a better politician

 

but was he any more persuasive?, 

 

so that lot aint worth a real-world shit,

 

And, just maybe, you've encapsulated all that is wrong with the state of politics today Marcus....?

 

More personable - could be read as "a nice bloke" (at least in public) but didn't actually achieve a busting lot other than assuaging the  incessant desire of certain portions of society for self-deprecating, so-called 'equality' and diversity.  Being 'nice' as a personal attribute, is pretty low on my scale of importance when considering the necessary character of a world leader.  Maybe a bonus as a side dish, but the main course should be considerably more substantial.

 

A better politician -  only in so far as popular vote = office and taking the tough decisions = unpopular which in turn = no office.

 

More persuasive - see above, re popular vote, but where is the evidence of a tangible legacy of Obama domestic and global effect?  

 

Real world of shit - see above, can any Obama 'fan' list the legacy of domestic and global effect post Obama so that we might compare with actual progress in the short period of Trump administration?

 

No doubt Trump presents a character which is so easy to dislike, so easy to condemn, so easy to mock....  But the empirical outputs stand in testimony to his credibility in office.  Even I find it easy to 'dislike' him, but I don't have to 'like' him to recognise the changes that are happening on his watch.

 

When the population start to vote for politicians that they may dislike, but can recognise as capable, rather that the sort of X factor popularity stakes, maybe we'll start to get somewhere....  ?

[stihlmadasever]

Ignore the fact this is an snp mp just listen to  how things dont get done in westminster.

For those who dont have facebook perhaps someone with more technical know how then me can put this up.

Our political system doesnt work,fact!

 

https://www.facebook.com/100003783289466/posts/1262563663879731/

[difflock]

As opposed to some of my line managers, who preferred plausible personable politically aware syncopants, I always preferred working with those who were capable of doing the job they were paid to do, even if they were abrupt, bytimes rude and crude in their comments, and lacking in the small talk, apparently such small talk being so essential to the workplace in Local Government that it merited promotions, i.e. "he/she will fit in".

Unlike a local highly respected kitchen fitter known to all as "Silent Sam", because he worked instead of talking.

But could never be employed by any LA, simply because he would not fare well at interview.

cheers

mth

Edited June 16, 2018 by difflock

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

1 minute ago, Chessa said:

Obama was no “small talker”. He was a natural Orator. 

 

Not all he did was good, but much of the good he did whilst in office is unrecognisable now - having been dismantled by his nemesis.

Natural orator? Long, flowing, easy on the ear passages with no substance, no controversy, nothing to get excited about...

 

What though? What did he achieve that was (a) “good” and (b) worse now?

 

Detail rather than emotion....

[5 shires]

30 minutes ago, Chessa said:

However, (in contrast to the previous President), it is probable that most policy making and delivery by the current president is triggered by raw emotion though.

Money as always been the biggest incentive in politics as in any other walk of life..people who have power and have come from nothing can be brought...one thing about trump he can’t be and that’s why he can do and say as he pleases..and in my view and only my opinion I think that’s a good thing and a breath of fresh air.i wish he was running our country right now for many reasons and we certainly wouldn’t have been pissing about for 2 years with brexit..he would have sorted that the day after we voted to leave.

[difflock]

8 hours ago, Chessa said:

Just off top of my head: good but, then repealed: Obamacare? Various specific Acts relating to LGBTQ+ rights, (repealed on the day Trump swore in as President) UN human rights council membership (today).

 

These views are my own. They are just views, unresearched - so any specific analysis relating to initiation dates and long term effects pre and post repeal are not supported by lengthy justification of postulation by me here. 

I cannot pass judgement on Obama care, or its likely long term efficacy(bearing in mind our failing/failed NHS)

but

Other than Obama care, diddy-squat=zilch of actual substance, per your quote above.

cheers

mth

P.S.

I agree Obama was an Orator, but so was Hitler, and perhaps Hitler actually achieved more?

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

8 hours ago, Chessa said:

Just off top of my head: good but, then repealed: Obamacare? Various specific Acts relating to LGBTQ+ rights, (repealed on the day Trump swore in as President) UN human rights council membership (today).

 

These views are my own. They are just views, unresearched - so any specific analysis relating to initiation dates and long term effects pre and post repeal are not supported by lengthy justification of postulation by me here. 

I wouldn't want to disagree with you Chessa (or anybody else that overtly dislikes Trump.) He makes it very easy for lots of people to simply dislike him.  What I wanted to try to understand is WHY people think he's not delivering the goods in his current role.  

 

You mention Obamacare (and that is probably the single biggest soundbite that people on this island relate to Obama as a 'good' thing that was undone by Trump.)  In doing so, I think 'we' fail to recognise that it was a massively unpopular system on that side of the pond which would have been disbanded by the next Republican majority regardless if that had been Trump or otherwise - so it's an easy (could say lazy) but inappropriate way to define the difference between Trump & Obama.  

 

Your other 2 examples appear to be in direct conflict with each other....

 

Aren't both persecuted minorities???  Are you suggesting that a lesser degree of support for 1 minority group is bad whilst at the same time appearing to suggest that more support for a different minority is bad?  

 

I 'get' how people can dislike Trump, but I want to believe there's more to it than narrow minded prejudice and discrimination....