Making the news today....

[the village idiot]

I think it's important to take on board that we have to do something.

 

Our current system is simply not going to work once the number of available jobs is dramatically decreased. Like it or not, the system will have to change.

 

Automation will create high levels of extra wealth for the few that are fortunate enough to be in a position to impliment it, whilst simultaneously removing the option to work standard jobs from millions of people.

 

If we don't find a way to spread the wealth created by these new technologies, and keep roofs over people's heads we are in deep doo doo.

 

You can leave moral ethics off the table if you like and view something akin to UBI as a necessity for maintaining a society in which it is at all desirable for an individual (however wealthy) to live. 

 

Yes, some people who are genuinely lazy will get their basic needs met for free, but this will be a relatively insignificant price to pay when you consider the alternatives of sticking with a system not fit for a coming new reality.

Edited February 20, 2018 by the village idiot

[TIMON]

I think it's important to take on board that we have to do something.
 
Our current system is simply not going to work once the number of available jobs is dramatically decreased. Like it or not, the system will have to change.
 
Automation will create high levels of extra wealth for the few that are fortunate enough to be in a position to impliment it, whilst simultaneously removing the option to work standard jobs from millions of people.
 
If we don't find a way to spread the wealth created by these new technologies, and keep roofs over people's heads we are in deep doo doo.
 
You can leave moral ethics off the table if you like and view something akin to UBI as a necessity for maintaining a society in which it is at all desirable for an individual (however wealthy) to live. 
 
Yes, some people who are genuinely lazy will get their basic needs met for free, but this will be a relatively insignificant price to pay when you consider the alternatives of sticking with a system not fit for a coming new reality.

Bring back National Service!!!
Works for Sweden (and Israel)

[onetruth]

Re: universal basic income.

 

It's a radical policy, not necessarily a leftist one, though.  Robots and computers are going to replace people in so many jobs over the next quarter century, I think it is very probable that most governments are going to adopt something like ubi.  It would certainly simplify the administration of benefits, tax collection and whatnot, but that is perhaps overstated as automation will continue to make all bureaucracy less expensive to administer.  There will still be wealth generation from what is (physically) produced, but it will be less labour dependent.  The solution will be to figure out a way of taxing the corporations generating the wealth, and redistributing it to the populace.  

 

Someone above described it as a dream for lazy people.  It might be (aren't they already supported?), but it will also allow so many more of us to produce art, music, entertainment; care for the sick, elderly, lonely; spend more time raising our children; spend more time expanding our minds.  

 

It's not a socialist pipedream but it would serve society if more of us do not have to dedicate so much of our lives to chasing the paycheque we need to get through the next week.   Loads of "ifs", I know.  

[tree-fancier123]

2 hours ago, difflock said:

Communism is simply the politics of Envy and Jealousy, all dressed up in Utopian cloths.

Which instead of asking how some manage to better themselves, choose to blame them for bettering themselves, rather than the impoverished writer, therefore a confiscation of their wealth would make everything "right".

Right!

It seems to me, both communism and capitalism are terrible. How can a locum doctor get away with charging the NHS £1000 per shift. Sure the doctor will be a highly educated motivated life saver - but they are effectively saying 'pay our ransom or we will let the patients die'

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/health/locum-doctors-nhs-120-an-hour-liaison-figures-staff-shortage-hospitals-a7713331.html

 

'NHS Improvement said last month that one hospital regularly paid a locum doctor £360 an hour, or £3,600 for a ten-hour shift.' If that doctor wasn't a pig or nothing

 

In addition to the greedy locum doctors there are numerous press reports of pharmaceutical companies charging extortionate money to supply drugs to the NHS. Seems to me nationalizing drug manufacture and research would be sensible. Why not have pharmacologists and chemical engineers directly payed by public money. Cut out the middle man

Edited February 20, 2018 by tree-fancier123

[Mark Bolam]

'Taxing corporations'.

 

I'll admit theres an area that could do with some improvement.

[scotspine1]

 

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/mobile.nytimes.com/2017/07/20/opinion/finland-universal-basic-income.amp.html

 

 

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

4 hours ago, Mark Bolam said:

Sounds like a workshy scroungers dream.

 

I'm sure it would be extremely popular.

Can't quite make out if you're running a flag up in favour or against.....?

 

I could become a work shy (er,er,er) scrounger with this system....  What's not to like??  

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

3 hours ago, difflock said:

Communism is simply the politics of Envy and Jealousy, all dressed up in Utopian cloths.

Which instead of asking how some manage to better themselves, choose to blame them for bettering themselves, rather than the impoverished writer, therefore a confiscation of their wealth would make everything "right".

Right!

to add....

 

Whilst the ruling elite (in a socialist system) pamper themselves at the cost of the proletariat....

 

There isn't a single example where this is not verifiable fact.  

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

1 hour ago, TIMON said:

 

Bring back National Service!!!
Works for Sweden (and Israel)

 

There's no place in a modern (streamlined) professional military for taking up the slack of society...

 

Sweden maintains a national reserve in the face of the historic Soviet invasion threat and Israel has an omni-present threat from all corners of its borders.  They are both very distinct and different reasons for their situations.  

 

There is insufficient capacity, nor is it the role of a modern military force, to babysit the elements of UK society that struggle to breath and tie shoe laces at the same time!

[TIMON]

There's no place in a modern (streamlined) professional military for taking up the slack of society...
 
Sweden maintains a national reserve in the face of the historic Soviet invasion threat and Israel has an omni-present threat from all corners of its borders.  They are both very distinct and different reasons for their situations.  
 
There is insufficient capacity, nor is it the role of a modern military force, to babysit the elements of UK society that struggle to breath and tie shoe laces at the same time!

You’ve obviously come up against this suggestion before, then?!

Or more to the point, you were the poor so n so that was expected to lick them into shape!

I can sympathise [emoji41]