Alpine tractor talk

[simonm]

I've asked about getting a loader on a pivot steer. They're not too keen due to the reduced stability of the two halves of the machine can move independently. Lots of alpines out there with loaders on.

 

Do the front steer only ones pivot in the middle? i have being told the pivot steer ones have a weak point in the middle and are therefore not suited to a loader. I thought they all pivot in the middle though?

[richy_B]

Do the front steer only ones pivot in the middle? i have being told the pivot steer ones have a weak point in the middle and are therefore not suited to a loader. I thought they all pivot in the middle though?

 

I thought the same as you. My own terminology might confuse this further but the 'axle steering' ones have a horizontal pivot allowing it to 'adjust to uneven terrain. Articulated steer have a vertical pivot allowing it to turn (and often a horizontal as well). I was discussing it on here recently in relation to heavy implements (1000kg lift) on the 3pl as a potential weakspot.

 

I can definitely see why a pivot would be a weak point for a tractor loader. That said though most shovels/ wheeled loaders are artic steer so i maybe talking nonsense!

[Commando]

Do the front steer only ones pivot in the middle? i have being told the pivot steer ones have a weak point in the middle and are therefore not suited to a loader. I thought they all pivot in the middle though?

 

 

The front steer versions pivot on the axle only, so if you drop a wheel on a slope they won't pitch you over. Certainly on the AGT.

[openspaceman]

I thought the same as you. My own terminology might confuse this further but the 'axle steering' ones have a horizontal pivot allowing it to 'adjust to uneven terrain. Articulated steer have a vertical pivot allowing it to turn (and often a horizontal as well). I was discussing it on here recently in relation to heavy implements (1000kg lift) on the 3pl as a potential weakspot.

 

I can definitely see why a pivot would be a weak point for a tractor loader. That said though most shovels/ wheeled loaders are artic steer so i maybe talking nonsense!

 

Yes the articulated ones pivot vertically at the centre but either have an axle pivot or a horizontal pivot in the middle to accommodate bumps. The centre pivot could be a weak point but as you say many front loading shovels are articulated (Anyone know anything about running a ford A64??). In practice the front loader on my A55 could pick the rear end complete with igland 3002 and butt plate clear off the ground with no breakages, steering couldn't hold it straight though and this is significant with an unbraked trailer going down hill as it can push the back round.

 

The stability issue is simple geometry, the centre of gravity of both rigid and articulated machines acts straight down. All the time the line of action is inside the area bounded by the point of contact of the 4 wheels the thing won't tip over. When on a side slope the line of action moves toward the lower wheels. Turn the steering on an rigid when the line of action is just within a line between the two lower wheels and nothing changes. Do the same with an artic steer and you open the gap between front and back wheels by turning up hill and the line between the points of contact of the lower two wheels moves up hill so you open a hole into which the tractor falls.

 

This problem becomes fairly insignificant as long as you remember not to turn up hill, reverse turn down first.

[Oaklay]

Do the front steer only ones pivot in the middle? i have being told the pivot steer ones have a weak point in the middle and are therefore not suited to a loader. I thought they all pivot in the middle though?

 

 

Our pasquali is front steer but completely pivots in the middle. Where the line is in photo. Ours work really hard on site clearance have never had an issue using a loader on a alpine. We lift and carry big lumps all the time.

[RDB logs]

Hello rich ,Where's the loader ?

 

Hi nick, she will go back on when I get time, it's all piped up and I did toy with the idea of quick releases on the pipes, I need to sort road lights and indicators, I was very excited to buy the number plate!

 

I also need to fit the belly plates and cab guard, back window paint doors, repair wipers, re seal turbo, re line roof, repair stereo, fit new check chains, etc etc!!

 

It's a great machine, do you still have yours?

[Commando]

Our pasquali is front steer but completely pivots in the middle. Where the line is in photo. Ours work really hard on site clearance have never had an issue using a loader on a alpine. We lift and carry big lumps all the time. [ATTACH]207434[/ATTACH][ATTACH]207435[/ATTACH]

 

 

Nice setup! What will the loader lift?

[CalumH]

Evening All,

 

Firstly, thanks for phoning last week Simon. Always a pleasure to speak with you and I hope the discussion was useful... I'll email you some further information during this week on our Carraro and AGT range of alpines.

 

Barton, many thanks for raising the American/Canadian thread. It doesn't come up often but we will never shy away from it to reassure customers (current and new) .

 

I must start by saying that the American/Canadian thread is now approaching 8 years old and, to our knowledge, it is the only case in the world like it (I have searched the internet and asked AC but I can’t find anything similar to this scale). In addition, as a reader, we only hear the customer’s side of the story and not AC, Sigma or the dealer’s. So it wouldn't be fair to draw any conclusions and this isn’t the place for me to discuss it any further.

 

As for supplying loaders these days we are more than happy to do so but there are certain factors to consider. The main one is that customer will tend to opt for an alpine tractor because of the well balanced set up, usually for bank mowing or slope use. Unlike a normal compact, the engine on an Alpine will tend to be seated beyond the front axle making it a very well balance unit with an implement on the back (like a flail mower, or similar). By adding the brackets, loader and implement over the bonnet you’ll simply make the front end a lot heavier and the set up less balanced. But for clearance work, on flat ground, with a counter weight it’ll be a great tool with respectable high HP and low impact.

 

If a customer were to request a loader we’ll normally try to push a tractor with the bi-directional seating option like an AGT850 or Carraro TTR4400, TRX6400, TRX7800s etc. This is because rear loaders will give the operator a much better view of whats going on when the seats turned 180 degrees and facing backwards (over the linkage). The engine/bonnet end can then also act as a ‘counter weight’.

 

With artic steering tractors we only have two within our range (excluding the sp4400) and these are the AGT835 and Carraro SRX. The tractors obviously steer on a pivot and do have the oscillation/tilt at the front end. Neither of these models, to my knowledge, have a loader option available. We believe this is simply down to stability but we have supplied linkage mounted fork lifts for these models which keep the weight close into the tractor.

 

I hope this has been helpful, and feel free to pm me if I can help any further

 

BR

Calum@Riko

[Oaklay]

Nice setup! What will the loader lift?

 

 

Thanks, it will lift half a ton plus the grab right up no worries, more if you only want to get it just off the ground

[simonm]

Seems some recommend no loader others are not so concerned, whats it like on site? is it maneuverable? do they have a forward reverse shuttle? hydrostatic? or have a clutch?