Top handle saw use on the ground

[Mortimer Firewood]

We will both be banished to the twilight zone Mark .

 

Hope there's room for a 3rd

[peatff]

You can do it if you can justify it through your risk assessment. One handed on the ground is difficult to justify though

 

Not it you only have 1. Arm !!!

 

Yes I always use mine single handed on the ground since I cut my other arm off using the top handle single handed on the ground I ask a passer by to start it for me.

[Daythe trees]

Read through this thread and not sure where I stand overall, which is hypocritical as I use my top handles on the ground! Sometimes that small top handle saw where you can do a nice tidy cut is so much better for the tree if it's staying than a rear handle which just won't fit. My 280tes on an 8 inch bar is easier to manoeuvre in tight spaces and avoid cutting what is staying than a silky. I will continue to judge each situation and continue.

[aspenarb]

The bottom line here is as a self employed person on private work you can use what you like, wear what you like, top handle saws on the floor, chuck n duck chippers and saws with no chainbrakes. It all changes when employing people or working as a contractor.

 

Bob

[treequip]

The bottom line here is as a self employed person on private work you can use what you like, wear what you like, top handle saws on the floor, chuck n duck chippers and saws with no chainbrakes. It all changes when employing people or working as a contractor.

 

Bob

 

Hmmmmm

 

That might be true for a private individual but,,,,,,

 

The HSE is under the impression that we owe a duty of care to everyone, including ourselves

 

Discuss,,,,,,,,

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

Hmmmmm

 

 

 

That might be true for a private individual but,,,,,,

 

 

 

The HSE is under the impression that we owe a duty of care to everyone, including ourselves

 

 

 

Discuss,,,,,,,,

 

 

Agreed, you can be prosecuted for exposing yourself to unnecessary risk, plenty of examples of prosecutions.

[aspenarb]

Come on now chaps you know full well that Joe Likely of no fixed abode can door knock and get tree work. He is not required by law to be insured or have any qualifications , it is basically left down to the customer to evaluate his competence and professionalism. A totally unqualified/uninsured Joe Likely can trim hedges, cut trees mow lawns and tarmac drives in his bare feet in boxer shorts if he wants to and absolutely nothing will come of it. HSE have no say in what he does and in the event of him being hospitalised it will go down in the book as a work related accident. End of, in the event of him killing himself it would probably be called misadventure. Excrement would only hit the fan if one of his employees injured/killed himself.

 

Bob

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

Come on now chaps you know full well that Joe Likely of no fixed abode can door knock and get tree work. He is not required by law to be insured or have any qualifications , it is basically left down to the customer to evaluate his competence and professionalism. A totally unqualified/uninsured Joe Likely can trim hedges, cut trees mow lawns and tarmac drives in his bare feet in boxer shorts if he wants to and absolutely nothing will come of it. HSE have no say in what he does and in the event of him being hospitalised it will go down in the book as a work related accident. End of, in the event of him killing himself it would probably be called misadventure. Excrement would only hit the fan if one of his employees injured/killed himself.

 

 

 

Bob

 

 

The mechanism to prosecute JL under the circumstances you describe above already exists.

 

But as you also say, the likelihood is very slim! That just demonstrates an unwillingness / inability to enforce rather than an absence of legal recourse.

[Old Mill Tree Care]

I never use a top handled saw whilst in contact with the ground.

 

I just jump whilst blipping the throttle.

 

 

I get in the van and hang out the window to cut.

That way my feet aren't on the ground and it's nice and comfy.

For thick wood I slow down to 5mph!

[AA Teccie (Paul)]

Hi all, im having a bit of a disagreement with a guy at work, he is a grass cutter and dosent know anything about tree surgery but is 2nd foreman!, ive been a tree surgoen (climber+groundsman) for nearly 9 years now and have a level 3 qualification, but he dosent allow me to use a top handle saw on the ground! but for pruning cuts on trees (for limbs bigger than silky size) you get a far better cut than using a groundsaw! dispite in my last 8 years of tree surgery both my previous bosses allowed me to use top handle saws on hedge reductions from the ground and on banks or generally where its safer to use a more compact saw

 

i know top handle saws are for tree climbing only but can they be used for ground based pruning, does anyone know what the law says about this? afag and the hse websites dont cover it!

 

cheers

 

Alex

 

Apologies here as I'm sure this has moved on but direct HSE guidance on 'Chainsaws at Work' (indg317, see below) reinforces AFAG 308 stating:

Top-handled chainsaws

These saws have the rear handle over the top of the engine. They are only suitable for use off the ground by trained competent arborists. They are not designed for use on the ground or as a substitute for small, rear-handled chainsaws.

 

So, as others have pointed out this is what the industry 'good practice' guidance says and although it is not 'law' you need to think very carefully about the potential consequences of not following such...if something goes wrong. The HSE / insurance companies / clients / AA will refer to published guidance as a benchmark and start their assessment of "what went wrong" from there.

 

IMHO the temptation to 'cut n hold' on the ground, particular with the branch going in the chipper...not rather NOT going into the chipper, thereby bring the chain in close proximity to the left-hand, is massive.

 

Take care out there..

Paul

 

PS there are 'lightweight' battery driven chainsaws out there now which are ideal for sitting alongside the chipper for use when needed...the 'rear-handled' version of course.

indg317.pdf

Edited June 11, 2015 by AA Teccie (Paul)