Have you ever bottled it?

[scotspine1]

We have to take it down on monday.

 

what happened? poor pruning practices by the last company to work on the tree?

[gibbon]

Yeah, it was mutilated.

 

It's reqqly knackered and the client has finally decided to stop hugging it.

[Tom D]

I was supposed to monolith a dead beech last week, we had to wait for the bat inspector to look at it first but he refused to climb it. I thought it would be bad form to monolith it after that so we felled it. ( I would have though )

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

Hell yeah.

 

Twice I went back up the next day and nailed it after a night of terror.

 

More than a few times I have been unable to do/get as high as I want, and bombed dead tops out causing very little collateral damage!

 

Ballsy post Gibbon. Respect.

 

 

Ive only just caught this thread and agree with Mark, this is a ballsy post and respect is due for it.

 

It is down to certain members to do the bold stuff, Gibbons a very well (justly so) respected climber and therefore his postings can be trusted to be of a known quantity. As opposed to some young lad who just bottled an average job.

 

I think we can safely assume the tree in question was a right knarly PITA!

 

In my 25 years climbing trees I have seen my fair share of knarly situations, our nerve is our best friend and worst enemy, we are always faced with finding the balance between being bold and being suicidal.

 

Ive never bottled on a dangerous tree, but I did bottle a tree that was subject to hornets that where attracted along with butterlfies and other beasties to the fermenting boozey liquids under the bark.

 

I think its important to stress that no one should hold it against an individual climber for bottling a particular job, it takes more guts to back down and admit you cant handle this one than we generaly give credit for. I did a tree last week (images to follow) that I was asked to do after another well seasoned climber had refused to do and had said a MEWP was the ONLY option.

 

Fortunately the scenarios that push the climbers bottle limits are few and far between these days, our tree stock is not what it once was, gone are the days when a climber could specialise and only do the "big wood" Wether or not it was fortune or misfortune, im still unclear! but I found myself in that situation early on, the bigger and knarly-er they got, the more my name came up! but I was young, fit as a flea and had balls the size of coconuts and they was made of pure brass (apparently!)

 

But that said, we now work in an industry that has changed, for the better I might add, there is no place for that kind of mindset, and we have ways and means of doing things differently today.

 

There is nothing wrong with using these options wisely and in not being an idiot by flexing ones pecks and saying oh get out the way I will do it cos Im ard enough:lol:

 

if any of you climbers ever feel that this one or that one is beyond you dont push on because you fear youll be considered a wimp, if that is how you feel, the culture at your firm is wrong and any of the mature respected climbers on this forum will back you up:thumbup1:

 

I would NEVER expect anyone to do the sort of S...t I was allowed to get away with as a young man, if I saw anyone working like that these days I would handbrake the car and be "aving a word", cos its not the way.

 

I do have a very different view of things because i started and for the first 8 years of my climbing life I worked at the rouge trader end, well not really a rouge trader a well meaning guy but he hadnt a clue about treework. I was 15, and had no idea this was not a normal thing to be doing, I was never asked if I was o.k with what we was doing, I was told to get up it and stop thinking about it!

 

I pressed on through my fears, I didnt want to be thought of as useless and that fear was far greater than a fear of dying to me, but i had grown up to believe that I was useless and was pre disposed to being a pleaser. That made me go to limits few could follow, and it was INSANE and very very STUPID. I wish someone had asked me if I was o.k with this, or would you prefer we got somone more experienced for this one!

 

on the other hand, i am the man I am today because of those early days, so like I said, its a fine line between pushing past your fears, and listening to them, we must ALL learn when to say no, I never could and still have an innate disability to do so.

 

This industry is one of those whose work is done by men for the most part (changing though and a good thing for our industry, women will bring a different perspective to how things will be done) and men are lets say not the most forgiving and compassionate sorts, and arbs well times ten! dont take any notice of those old vets, we may tease but deep down we hold no ill will to anyone who has the guts to say NO, that aint for me!

 

For me this threads bought back a lot of feelings and emotions regarding what it feels like to be in that between a rock and a hard place, do what scares you or get the lads ribbing you for ALL eternity, and worse the boss thinking you aint up to the job.

 

I ahve the utmost respect for Gibbon in this very important subject for having the guts to say No and admit it in public, he isa braver man a better man than I, for there was many occasions I would have like to have had the guts to do likewise.

 

Dont any of you guys and girls out there EVER feel like I did and still do, if you dont like it say so, dont let any one make a monkey of you and force you into a task you feel ill prepared for or unsafe in doing.

[MattyF]

Nice post tony.. The fear of being useless definiety over comes the fear of dying!! I even used to be scared of heights before I started climbing.

 

The only tree I have bottled was a big hybrid poplar in high winds over live cables .. And that was more down to the fear of wiping out the electric and being given the bill.

[JimM]

Like Hama, I've just caught this thread.

 

We've a saying in the RAF....

 

There are old pilots,

There are bold pilots,

But there are no old, bold pilots.

 

From many, many years of watching how teams work, one of the biggest threats to life and limb is peer pressure...what others may think.

 

It's a really hard thing for the youngsters to deal with. Their only hope is that a sensible older head nearby sees what's in their mind and reels them in. The comment above, where the young lad was moved to another tree is a great example of that.

 

The other term we have is "pressonitis". Where the bit is firmly between the teeth and tunnel vision stops up the ears. Sensible options are not listened to and the risk level of the situation has just jumped exponentially. (Usually the time when a sensible soldier shoots his officer in the back of the head )

 

I can see the similarities as I jump from one "risky" career to another.

 

Withdraw, re-assess, and approach from a different angle, is one of the best bits of advice I've seen on the thread.

[gibbon]

Good post tony and thanks.

 

Can't believe you bottled hornets though. If they're just feeding on the tree those thing will just land on you and walk about. Wouldn't want to disturb a nest mind

[kev7937]

I've worked on a tree that I should have bottled ( it failed ) and Im sure I've bottled stuff when I could easily have gone higher and I've worked up a tree with feeding hornets without a problem

 

But in all honesty I'm the biggest chicken around.

 

Bottler and proud !!

[Adam Bourne]

just taken me an hour to read all this, awesome thread and some great stories/tales/advice/honesty/and some a load of shite........

 

glad you have been ask to go back and finish the job propers Matt and i know your more than capable of doing just that,

 

for the record yes i've bottled,

 

went in for a days subby work, 80ft crack willow more than half the tree was over 2 huge barns, they had no idea how to price it, i came down and told them the job needs a crane, no way was i going to get out far enough on the tips of crack willow, to do what over the barns???? sit and play with my pud???? ..........2 weeks later went back with crane and job done.......

 

all the people who have said your instinct is your best friend are 100% right,

 

don't forget the camera mate....

[jtw2140]

As a new climber, and a part time one at that, I am so relieved to find this thread!

 

I bottled it yesterday, no rhyme or reason, had a successful morning climbing on some awkward limbs (very large silver birch) but then topping it out I had a proper moment and my head was gone. Fortunately the lad I was with said "your heads gone, come down now" and he went up and cracked on! But I felt like theeee biggest of failures and like I really had 'jacked' on him. I searched for threads like this for some assurance that it was natural... Thanks all for sharing!