Russia Invades ukraine

[Johnsond]

2 hours ago, Mick Dempsey said:

My point was that in Russia the outcome is viewed from a very different perspective. 

As it is in regards Ukraine 🤷‍♂️that is a given surely 🤷‍♂️

[Mick Dempsey]

No it’s not a given, and it bears repeating.

Like almost everything in history.

The Russians believe that they ‘won’ the Winter War.

Edited December 14 by Mick Dempsey

[Johnsond]

4 hours ago, Mick Dempsey said:

No it’s not a given, and it bears repeating.

Like almost everything in history.

The Russians believe that they ‘won’ the Winter War.

🤔 Just  curious Mick whats you actual take or perspective on the Russian invasion of Ukraine. 
Regards the 39-40 winter war it’s widely accepted that Finland made the Russians pay a heavy price for the land they took, and pretty much convinced the Germans what a shambles they were. Of course it’s a given that two opposing sides are going to have a totally different perspective on any conflict especially when the Soviet/Russian press was then and is now state owned and controlled. 

[Timbermcpherson]

The Russians are basically living off the BS myth of the great patriotic war. Saying "world war 2" would require them explaining all their help of the Nazis for so much of the war. Putin got Dugan to rewrite ww2 and most of Stalins doings to suit his needs, and the Russian people lap it up, eager to having some time in there history to be (wrongly) proud of.

 

The fact is that post world war one,  the Russians helped rebuild the German military. It was impossible for the Germans to do this on their own territory under the Versailles treaty. The Russians give them a factory to assemble tanks, the ability to build up an airforce and the ground on which Gudarian started perfecting the tactics of blitzkrieg. 

Krupp made artillery there, Junkers developed and made bombers, the Kreigsmarine hid ships, and other fun programs involving the likes of poison gasses was run by the Germans in Russia. There was a pause in this after Hitler came to power but before long Stalin was supplying the Nazis the fuel, food, raw materials, supplies and strategic security that were CRITICAL to Hitler being able to attack the west.

 

The fun bit is that Hitlers invasion of Russia was fueled using fuel stores that were 67% supplied by Russia. Stalin had done so much to help the Nazi invasion while kneecapping his own military he should have gotten the Most Valuable Player award from the Nazis for the first 2 years of ww2.

 

Stalinist Darwinism meant people either had to flee or comply if they wanted to survive the decades he was in charge. In turn they raised their kids to be either willing henchmen or compliant sheep with little value if any, put on human life. 

 

The Soviets and Nazis behavior was very similar. But at the end of the war the Nazis were defeated, and in some cases prosecuted and re educated. The Russians just erased from memory their alliance with the Nazis (and executed many of there own people who had involvement on Stalins orders) and to this day, sprinkled that turd Stalin in glitter.

 

 

[Mick Dempsey]

 

Re. Your question @Johnsond.

I think Russia is an genuine threat.

No one on here really understands the various loyalties and affiliations in the border area, what’s Russian and what’s Ukrainian but the invasion was just that an invasion. So to save time and summarise, I’m pro Ukraine.

The Russians have been sold the war as a continuation of the fight against fascism.

 

I suppose there are parallels to be drawn with the war against Finland, one is that the Russian army is poorly equipped and motivated.

 

I’m guessing that when it ends Russia will claim victory in the same way.

 

I also suspect President Trump will be more interventionist than he led us to believe.

[Stubby]

I think Poland are building them selves up to be one of the next significant super powers . I don't know how that will affect things politically .

Edited December 15 by Stubby

[peds]

 

Handy piece of kit to have!

 

[topchippyles]

47 minutes ago, Stubby said:

I think Poland are building them selves up to be one of the next significant super powers . I don't know how that will affect things politically .

If the Russians invaded Poland they would get an absolute pasteing.

[sime42]

1 hour ago, Stubby said:

I think Poland are building them selves up to be one of the next significant super powers . I don't know how that will affect things politically .

 

True dat. They're an economic/industrial powerhouse and looking to be the same militarily. They'll replace Germany as the top dog of Europe soon I reckon, in manufacturing at least.

 

Probably good for us as they hate Russia with a passion.

 

 

[Stere]

hmmm don't think so?

 

Still the Germans eco is way larger

 

 

Country comparison Germany vs Poland 2024

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Country comparison, you can compare any two countries and see the data side by side. Here you have the comparison of...

 

 

And defense spend half the French &  Germans?

 

List of countries in Europe by military expenditures - Wikipedia

EN.WIKIPEDIA.ORG