Energy costs

[Treetom15]

21 hours ago, Dan said:

I was talking to a friend (who is often in the know) today about the energy ratings on houses and how poorly insulated most of the housing stock is here in the uk. He thinks that the government aren't going to regulate the house builders and landlords, but they are looking at telling mortgage lenders that their portfolios must have an average c rating across all properties. Its and interesting thought thats for sure. 

Surely it would make so much more sense to insure that the houses being built meet a good standard rather than trying to encourage people to buy from a smaller number of properties? I refuse to believe that construction companies couldn’t afford to build a house with slightly better insulation, solar PV, ground source heating etc?

[Treetom15]

38 minutes ago, Big J said:

 

Quality construction is entirely possible (see most of the rest of Europe) but the housing lobby is very strong here in the UK and any regulation that enforces better building regulations is bitterly resisted. 

 

The other fundamental issue is that we (as a nation) don't have a track record of valuing efficiency and quality in our houses. We treat them as investments, not homes, and whereas spending £30k on a house to save £50k in bills over 30 years makes perfect sense, it's not realised in the market value of the home, so it's rarely done. 

 

Many green technologies need a bit of space too. So geothermal boilers are a bit bigger, well insulated walls are thicker and external heat exchangers need a suitable location outside the property. The way that new houses are packed in, it doesn't allow much space for these things.

 

But you are right though. The cost difference between a well constructed house and a typical British house isn't that much. Until planning laws are completely overhauled so as to advantage self builders and people stop treating housing as an investment, we're doomed to living in the smallest and least environmentally efficient houses in Northern Europe.

Very good point re how we treat houses- our build (due to the financial cap on the resale price) will mean that to build we would be in negative equity should we want to sell it in the future; the bonus is we don’t want to sell it, so will happily spend more than it would be worth as the money/energy saved in the long run. 
Also spot on about space saving etc-our walls are approx 400mm of insulation, plus provision externally for the ASHP, plus all the additional things that go with that (larger hot water tank etc), which again could quite easily be introduced by building companies but it would definitely impact on the way In which they squeeze every mm out of the building plots. 
 

Personally, I think people who own 2nd, 3rd homes and/or rentals etc should be taxed far higher than they are. There is no need for one person to own so much property, especially when the replacements being built is so poor

[Woodworks]

1 hour ago, Treetom15 said:

Surely it would make so much more sense to insure that the houses being built meet a good standard rather than trying to encourage people to buy from a smaller number of properties? I refuse to believe that construction companies couldn’t afford to build a house with slightly better insulation, solar PV, ground source heating etc?

One of the problems from what I have seen is not the spec for the insulation so much as the quality of construction. I worked on a new extension putting in some oak A frames but helped with the rafters. I had to pop back and the builder was fitting Celotex in between the rafters. There were large gaps at the sides and I just asked if they were going to foam them up. Builder says with the blessing of the customer who was there that it would all be covered before BCs next visit! Same job went to fit some tricky skirting boards. There was a howling draught coming up from under the floor so lord knows what had gone on under the floor. 

 

I converted our barn and did all the insulation myself. It was above the spec of the time but below new regs. Still able to heat the whole place with one 7kWh wood-burner thats at tick-over. Air tightness and continuity of insulation makes a big difference IME

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

1 hour ago, Big J said:

the housing lobby is very strong here in the UK and any regulation that enforces better building regulations is bitterly resiste

It seems to me there are many strong lobby voices - retail, construction, transport, farming....

 

The only one conspicuous by its absence - and surprising since it is undeniably the largest - consumers!

 

People are too relaxed about accepting the patently unacceptable....

[AHPP]

7 minutes ago, Big J said:

 

Yep. Very much agree. 

 

I do think that part of it is that we just don't really realise how shit our housing is here. This clip from Alain de Bottain's Architecture of Happiness is really revealing, showing how much we conform to traditional ideals of house ownership in the UK:

 

 

That's just made me realise that it's Alain de Botton who does the School of Life video narration.

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

9 minutes ago, Big J said:

 

Yep. Very much agree. 

 

I do think that part of it is that we just don't really realise how shit our housing is here. This clip from Alain de Bottain's Architecture of Happiness is really revealing, showing how much we conform to traditional ideals of house ownership in the UK:

 

 

Eeeeeeek!

 

”...the best of modern architecture....”

 

Maybe - if you’re happy to live in a house inspired by an airport departure lounge. 
 

There are great historic skills and knowledge inextricably linked to social and historical influences which run through a large portion of the established UK housing market.  
 

Houses built in a certain place for a certain purpose - not necessarily architect designed, but built by skilled and knowledgeable master tradesmen that had a living connection with the location, prevailing climate and social requirement. 
 

Yes - late ‘development’ houses are shite of design and construction but it would be shortsighted to focus only on that aspect and apply it across the entire subject. 
 

[Stere]

Think a new well insulated house can be in any style modernist or vernacular  or look like a hobbit house from LOTR

 

That model village poundsbury prince charles built looks odd

 

 

Its like the uncanny valley version of architecture?

 

Uncanny valley - Wikipedia

EN.WIKIPEDIA.ORG

 

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

3 minutes ago, Stere said:

Think a new well insulated house can be in any style modernist or vernacular  or look like a hobbit house from LOTR

 

That model village poundsbury prince charles built looks odd

 

 

Its like the uncanny valley version of architecture?

 

Uncanny valley - Wikipedia

EN.WIKIPEDIA.ORG

 

I like a lot of what Poundbury stands for, some concepts / covenants are a bit strange but overall, I likey. 

[sime42]

I like a lot of what Poundbury stands for, some concepts / covenants are a bit strange but overall, I likey. 

Very good ideas in theory but rather odd in practice. Have you been there? I have; it was all quite disconcerting. Not bad, just disconcerting. The blurred lines between pedestrian spaces and traffic spaces, between commercial and domestic areas, between municipal and private spaces. Maybe it's still just too new, needs time to weather in.

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

23 minutes ago, sime42 said:

1 hour ago, kevinjohnsonmbe said:

I like a lot of what Poundbury stands for, some concepts / covenants are a bit strange but overall, I likey. 

Very good ideas in theory but rather odd in practice. Have you been there? I have; it was all quite disconcerting. Not bad, just disconcerting. The blurred lines between pedestrian spaces and traffic spaces, between commercial and domestic areas, between municipal and private spaces. Maybe it's still just too new, needs time to weather in.

Yeah, been there, ages ago.  Really liked it - as a casual visitor. 
 

Interesting that you find the shared space disconcerting. That was one factor that I was exceptionally drawn to - people taking responsibility for the consequences of their actions, not being channelled into predetermined lanes just because that is how it is marked up. No markings equals no  presumed ‘rights’ of way - everyone just finds their own path....