Rupe

I am not going into detail cos I dont have the figures at hand, but for a small company, a third on wages, and a third on costs would be about right. And then of course those costs get broken down into smaller things like fuel etc. Advertising: 5% is lot to spend on advertising. It makes me laugh when I hear tree companies saying they took out a £800 ad in YP, and got an £800 job from it in the first month so thats that advert paid for!!! Ha, hilarious!! An £800 ad needs £16K of work to make it 5% of that work. If you get other work to cover it so that advertising ends up as being 5% of all work then your other jobs are paying for your advertising. So most companies get work from word of mouth but still spend 5% or more on advertising, its madness IMO. If a sole trader can take more than 30-35% of turnover into profit then they are doing ok (as long as turnover is big enough that a third is enough to live on) As companies get larger then the % profit is less, but 10% of a £1M is better than 35% of £80K if you have the finances to allow you to turn that over without a nervous breakdown!! I get stressed if Im owed 5K so would hate to think what its like being owed 50 odd!!

There could also be misinterpretation going on here. The LA might have suggested he look at the AAAC's list, and then on top of that he doesnt want the OP to do the work for whatever reason, it could be anything, maybe he doesnt like you or your appearance, or wahtever it may be. The client then says he can only use AAAC's, this may not be the truth but what he is saying is that you havnt got the job!! If its happening a lot then maybe its not the AAAC's pushing in, maybe your going for the wrong clients?? If your client (in this instance, not an actual client) is not influenced by cost, then maybe his reasons for not hiring you are not the AAAC thing at all. There are many people who have no idea about the AA, and are after cost saving and nothign else. I believe there is a market for everybody in tree work, but their market share is upto them to achieve/improve. And ELG, I dont think you are correct, there is no good old boys club going on, I have been working for LA's for years and have only just recenty got AAAC status. Its more a case of the right person/company for the job. LA's can choose there own contractors or use AAAC's its upto each individual LA's legal dept to decide on the protocol. And the OP was talking about planning applications through the council not direct work for LA's. The facts are that applications are for the tree(s) and have no relevance to the person/company who may or may not carry out the work within the 2 years allowed period.

On my truck?

Worse case scenario would be slipped disc, quite a high disc by the sounds of it which is more rare than the normal lumber region slipped discs, but just as debilitating. Hopefully, for you, its just an inflamed nerve which will pass. This is quite a different thing to a slipped disc but the pain is the same but should go in a day or so and Ibuprofen might help. Slipped discs though (herniated disc is the correct term) can take a while to sort themselves out, stronger pain killers might be required but only the doc can tell you that. If its the same in 24 hours then go to the docs, call an ambo if you have to.

They cant turn down an application for works based on the company doing the work, thats not possible, the application can be made by anyone, its for the tree work, not for the applicant. So, an AA company could make out the application and once its given the landowner could tell them to cancel the job and then get the local guy in to do it using the same permission granted. This can work the otherway round aswell of course. LA's tend to use the AAAC list as a possible source of good arbrorist, simply becasue there insurance will not allow them to give other recomendations. One LA near me (I was talking to him today) is not allowed to even give out a sheet with AAAC's on it, he HAS to suggest the client goes to the AA website and looks up the list there, but even then he is not saying they HAVE to use that list, and the application for permsissions is not based on who does the work (as I have said already, sorry). But, if the LA is implying the an AAAC should be used then its up to you to inform your (potential) client, that whilst that is a good source of legitimate companies its not the only source, other good contractors do exist, and the LA should really have said that as well.

This happens a little over once a year in the states, its by no means a one off freak incident!!! Big chippers over there, and kids helping dads in the holidays, crazy but it happens more frequently than we would like to think!!

No, some are just muppetts!!

As said above Bartletts definatly use this method. Its perfectly ok to do so, it becomes part of your employment package. So if you get 15K a year at one place or £15.5K at another but have to buy your own saw then you can compare the two employment packages quite easily to decide which is best. As long as you are on enough to make it worthwhile buy the kit then its fine, but when looking at an employment contract you also look at holiday entitlement and other factors in order to decide if its a good offer or not, and buying your own saws is just another thing to take into account. One thing I would say though is that the companies using this method must have a good reason for it, and it seems to suggest that they dont trust their employees. Another example of this happening is in the mechanics trade. A fully employed mechanic would be expected to have his own general tools, but might get an allowance towards it. When he leaves for another job he takes his big snapon box with him. same principal really.

Your tipper conversions cost as much as I have ever paid for a subaru, it would treble its value!!

I might accidentally have to go and buy a Navara now, but I will try and wait until the subaru dies which will of course be never!!

She nearly work it out correctly using her own special method. Goes to show how girls logic is so round and round the point. I would!

VERY brittle, unlikely to fall over but branches snap easily. I did a big dead one before christmas and it was the least fun I have had in ages!! Couldnt rig the top out, there was no way it was safe for that, so kind of winged it with that bit, but managed to rig the trunks ok. MEWP would be ideal if there is access. Did it die from frost damage? Do you know if they have had other sensible quotes included MEWPS etc? its possible they are asking you because you havent factored everything properly so they can save a few quid.

Yes, my first employment was without chippers, and tying the brash down with your climbing rope at the end of the day was normal. Still got that three strand though, its doing fine!

I think you have a good grasp. You and tom10 can set up the support network for newbies and I'll keep out of it!

Ok, I might have misread you, or gone a bit off track with that post then.

In response to pedroski Agreed, I didnt make the original arb/dole example. I actaully said that its just as likely someone might go and be a success at another trade rather than go on the dole, even though it is just as difficult in other trades. Arb is weird because the money you can potentially spend on training and kit is so huge that we are going to end up with newbies who are funded by the bank of mumanddad (thats already happening) and they could be just as useless!. MY advice to newbies has always been "get a job" either landscaping or tree work or similar and get training slowly as yo go along. If you cant get a job in a physical outdoor trade of some kind then no amount of CS30's and PPE is going to help.

Are we talking lopper head not sawblade? I think I had that singtung thing then if its the lopper head. Worked ok but fell to bits. I now use wolf garten one, last forever but pole not very long. Silky for saw blades everytime though.

Well put. I guess being on the dole is miles down on your list of things to do?

Yep, I agree, but I dont believe Arb is the industry for anyone who would take the dole as the next best thing. So getting people into this industry instead of the dole is setting the standard way too low IMO. Dole/maccie D's/poundland/tesco/ etc etc etc and further up the list for the more inteligent/articulate/motivated and fit people would be tree work. Your actually devaluing the industry by suggesting we should be encouraging school leavers who would otherwise be on the dole, those people need help with work for sure, but arb does not have the support facilities for people who need a helping hand, thats just how it is, and arbtalk cannot make up for that. I admire your enthusiasm to help though.

I do hear what your saying Tom, but arb is not that great anyway, so anybody leaving here thinking "why should i bother" will just as likely make more of a success at something else anyway, and even if they would have made a good arb then it doesnt matter, theres too many so its no loss. Many failing arbs go on to make very good plumbers, sparkies, lawyers even, no worries, its not all about arb or dole, and if arb is the last step before the dole or maccie D's then that just about sums up where this industry is at the moment.

Good advice, a second hand chipper is the worst thing I ever bought, never again!!

As opposed to leaving thinking i may as well not bother and end up sitting on the dole or retraining in a well known fast food chain, for example. No, I think "do you want fries with that" is best for them!! If they give up because the virtual people on the interent wernt nice to them then they are no hopers, sorry thats how it is. Arbtalk is not here to create more Arbs, it might do but thats not its purpose (I dont think). We should be polite though, or maybe just not answer the silly questions at all, but then you would have just the other newbies giving advice which is not necessaarily a good thing. If they go to a careers advisory service they will only be told that they need tickets, if they go to get tickets they will only be told how much it costs, if they go to get a job they will only be told how much experience they need to have. Much better to try here first and if it sends some to maccie d's then no worries.

This was my first..............

They were cool !! Would have made a good pick up conversion!

Oh of course, and that shutler bloke maybe!