Making the news today....

[eggsarascal]

1 minute ago, Mick Dempsey said:

Getting bogged down in debates about class is a regular waste of time in this thread.

Agreed, but when ones had a right night of it and someone is spouting bollox about it it wears a bit thin.

[sime42]

I don't think you can buy Class. Amazon weren't selling it the last time I checked!

 

Even if you earn over £60k and have enough money to have 3 exotic holidays, 4 brand new cars, 6 children in private school, a country mansion with an indoor and outdoor pool, etc etc; it doesn't make you upper class, or even middle class for that matter. (It could also be argued that all that wasteful extravagance won't even make you a happier or nicer person). Though I could be confusing class with cultural capital.

[trigger_andy]

4 minutes ago, sime42 said:

I don't think you can buy Class. Amazon weren't selling it the last time I checked!

 

Even if you earn over £60k and have enough money to have 3 exotic holidays, 4 brand new cars, 6 children in private school, a country mansion with an indoor and outdoor pool, etc etc; it doesn't make you upper class, or even middle class for that matter. (It could also be argued that all that wasteful extravagance won't even make you a happier or nicer person). Though I could be confusing class with cultural capital.

Your confusing social classes with personality traits. 

[Retired Climber]

25 minutes ago, eggsarascal said:

Agreed, but when ones had a right night of it and someone is spouting bollox about it it wears a bit thin.

If you take it to heart every time someone talks bollox on the internet, you are in for a rough ride. Why on earth does it even matter? 

[eggsarascal]

3 minutes ago, Retired Climber said:

If you take it to heart every time someone talks bollox on the internet, you are in for a rough ride. Why on earth does it even matter? 

In the grand scheme of things it doesn't matter, but when people are spouting bollox, and more so, when they believe that bollox to be the truth it needs putting right. Or does it...

[Retired Climber]

2 minutes ago, eggsarascal said:

In the grand scheme of things it doesn't matter, but when people are spouting bollox, and more so, when they believe that bollox to be the truth it needs putting right. Or does it...

No, it doesn't. You will never put it right, and it's only bollox from your perspective anyway. Technicalities can 'technically' be wrong, but stuff like this is just opinion, based on life experience and beliefs. My opinion is no more valuable than yours, and yours is no more valuable than anyone else's. To think someone's opinion needs 'putting right' seems a little egotistical. 

I certainly wouldn't let it bother you.🙂

[eggsarascal]

18 minutes ago, Retired Climber said:

No, it doesn't. You will never put it right, and it's only bollox from your perspective anyway. Technicalities can 'technically' be wrong, but stuff like this is just opinion, based on life experience and beliefs. My opinion is no more valuable than yours, and yours is no more valuable than anyone else's. To think someone's opinion needs 'putting right' seems a little egotistical. 

I certainly wouldn't let it bother you.🙂

Opinion, hmm. Earning a decent wage does not change someone's class, would you agree?

 

Calling Aslef members out over an RMT strike isn't right, but people believe this nonsense. Yes, Aslef members have taken to the picket line recently, but that isn't what this RMT strike is about. Not egotistical, just the facts.

[Retired Climber]

12 minutes ago, eggsarascal said:

Opinion, hmm. Earning a decent wage does not change someone's class, would you agree?

 

Calling Aslef members out over an RMT strike isn't right, but people believe this nonsense. Yes, Aslef members have taken to the picket line recently, but that isn't what this RMT strike is about. Not egotistical, just the facts.

I agree that earning good money doesn't change one's class. I think I actually 'liked' the post in which you originally said that.

 

However. I also agree with @trigger_andy that what you seem to think as good money is firmly in working class territory anyway, therefore making the point somewhat moot. In my mind, anyone on the kind of money mentioned is only a few pay cheques away from destitute, not 'on good money'. 

 

I don't know enough about the RMT strikes to have a worthwhile.opinion on the matter, but do take your point. 

[eggsarascal]

3 minutes ago, Retired Climber said:

I agree that earning good money doesn't change one's class. I think I actually 'liked' the post in which you originally said that.

 

However. I also agree with @trigger_andy that what you seem to think as good money is firmly in working class territory anyway, therefore making the point somewhat moot. In my mind, anyone on the kind of money mentioned is only a few pay cheques away from destitute, not 'on good money'. 

 

I don't know enough about the RMT strikes to have a worthwhile.opinion on the matter, but do take your point. 

 

19 minutes ago, Retired Climber said:

I agree that earning good money doesn't change one's class. I think I actually 'liked' the post in which you originally said that.

 

However. I also agree with @trigger_andy that what you seem to think as good money is firmly in working class territory anyway, therefore making the point somewhat moot. In my mind, anyone on the kind of money mentioned is only a few pay cheques away from destitute, not 'on good money'. 

 

I don't know enough about the RMT strikes to have a worthwhile.opinion on the matter, but do take your point. 

It's all in perspective, up here a cottage with a decent garden with off road parking in a decent part of Cheshire can be had for about £170k, he says hopefully! So £250-£300/day is good money for a labour only contractor.

 

 

 

 

[trigger_andy]

41 minutes ago, Retired Climber said:

I agree that earning good money doesn't change one's class. I think I actually 'liked' the post in which you originally said that.

 

However. I also agree with @trigger_andy that what you seem to think as good money is firmly in working class territory anyway, therefore making the point somewhat moot. In my mind, anyone on the kind of money mentioned is only a few pay cheques away from destitute, not 'on good money'. 

 

I don't know enough about the RMT strikes to have a worthwhile.opinion on the matter, but do take your point. 

I know your initial point was not directed at me but surely your earnings and how you spend your money does change your class? There is a number of generally accepted key indicators that define your social class, this has nothing to do with how you conduct yourself. Fore example you could be a cleaner or Arb worker on minimum wage and be a lovely person who is a great father/mother, role model and does volunteering on the weekends, none of that will change the fact this person is working class as the key indicators define that class. The same goes for someone who is middle or upper class, they might be total arseholes and abuse their family and employees but being a horrid person does not define their social class either, the key indicators do.

 

For example, Rishi Sunak is clearly Upper to Elite Class.  How do we know or define this? Clearly its not according to his personality or how nice a person he is.  We can hardly say that he's a despicable POS therefore he must be working class can we? 

 

Wages are being eroded and inflated away in the UK, the only way to mitigate this is through strike action. I am in the very fortunate position to be employed in Norway where Unions and strike action are not seen in a negative light as they are in the UK. There is far to many jealous people in the UK who would rather see the Train Drivers lose their £60k a year instead of using this as a benchmark to better increase their wages. 

 

 

Edited August 12, 2022 by trigger_andy