Vat killing me!

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

Point of order M'lord.

 

Oatcake shop...... Although most were the front room of terraced houses, when I were a lad.

 

Dismissed Sir!

 

I didn't reference an oatcake "shop" but rather an oatcake retail outlet.... Which fully encompasses the window of a front room terraced house!

 

:lol:

[eggsarascal]

Dismissed Sir!

 

I didn't reference an oatcake "shop" but rather an oatcake retail outlet.... Which fully encompasses the window of a front room terraced house!

 

:lol:

 

It took me a while:sneaky2:......... How would Mr Johnson know about oatcakes?, then the light came on, your outlaws live just outside the city?

 

If you said oatcake retail outlet in Stoke you'd get a very vacant looking at.

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

It took me a while:sneaky2:......... How would Mr Johnson know about oatcakes?, then the light came on, your outlaws live just outside the city?

 

If you said oatcake retail outlet in Stoke you'd get a very vacant looking at.

 

Again... I might seek to disagree!

 

It has been my experience that the "very vacant looking at" is the default facial expression in the Potteries!!

 

I'm howling now and expecting a punch in the eye from the Mrs! She's already been asking why I'm talking about oatcakes!

[Ty Korrigan]

I've seen the odd thing like that. But to be honest, I see the knacker Lorry nearly every day up our area, and I think the vast majority are now disposed of legally around here.

 

When I worked in N.Z milking Jersey cows, the male calves where put into a shelter at the end of the drive and the knackers lorry came every few days for them. Any born out of season where land fill.

Now all our water was bore hole and there where another half dozen farms further up the valley from us.

After one of the workers was hospitalised with Leptospirosis, our borehole was tested and came in positive for Leptospirosis and E'coli as well as some other nasty diseases.

All those farms more remote than us also practice the same method of out of season carcass disposal.

Us, further down the valley recieved the fall out.

Ty

[Mull]

When I worked in N.Z milking Jersey cows, the male calves where put into a shelter at the end of the drive and the knackers lorry came every few days for them. Any born out of season where land fill.

 

Now all our water was bore hole and there where another half dozen farms further up the valley from us.

 

After one of the workers was hospitalised with Leptospirosis, our borehole was tested and came in positive for Leptospirosis and E'coli as well as some other nasty diseases.

 

All those farms more remote than us also practice the same method of out of season carcass disposal.

 

Us, further down the valley recieved the fall out.

 

Ty

 

 

The perils of drinking borehole water!

[skyhuck]

The perils of drinking borehole water!

 

A lot of mains water comes from boreholes

 

What was it you said earlier

[Mull]

A lot of mains water comes from boreholes

 

 

 

What was it you said earlier

 

 

Through a treatment system usually🙄

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

Oh dear kev, you've fairly got farmer bashing bit between your teeth now:),

 

That's a question for VOA really Richard - I merely highlighted the potential for reduced CT (on top of many other concessions) which are available in the Ag sector.

 

Been 'mulling' this over Mull!

 

It's not entirely accurate to describe my 'beef' as farmer bashing.... Quite the opposite if you accept the following, which I may have failed to articulate properly thus giving the impression, or allowing the interpretation to conclude it might be farmer bashing....

 

I think it's fairly accurate to say that the vast majority of my ranting has been against the system of subsidy (and associated concessions) rather than the activity of farming.

 

More accurately, the way in which the subsidy / concessions appear to be targeted to the advantage of the already very wealthy and perhaps those not actively engaged in working agriculture - to the distinct disadvantage of the smaller players - it certainly seems, that the bigger they are the more they benefit, the smaller they are the less they benefit where small seems to have greater direct connection to hands on work and larger has less.

 

Who's responsible for this? My interpretation is that it is wealthy land owners, the NFU, the CLA for example... All of which have considerable lobbying influence to maintain (and increase) the beneficial interests of the bigger players whilst brushing some crumbs aside to keep the plebs suckling at the teat of subsidy dependence and avoid a peasant uprising which would upset the gravy train.

 

I think it's beyond question that the ag sector operates in a considerably more favourable trading environment than any other UK business sector, that it is grossly inefficient and that, despite massive support, it actually contributes a piffling amount to GDP.

 

Despite this, I still, almost daily, have to listen to whining bustards telling me how hard they have it. It's amazing how quiet they go when I reel off the benefits they have over anyone else and, as often as not, I've already looked at their subsidy payments and that's when the bubble really bursts because a lot don't seem to know that it's open source information!

 

I don't include Richard and CS in that bracket because they both give a 'reality check' of the real life difficulty of making money in farming at the grass roots level. And that they do, is surely a reality check and example of exactly WHY the current system is inherently flawed. If only those IN the system would recognise the inequity rather than cling hopelessly to an ever decreasing share of what the big players have been living rich off for too long.

 

Rather than it being a question for the VOA Richard, perhaps it might be better levelled at the NFU? Why is this another example of support for larger / land owning farmers rather than smaller / perhaps tenant farmers? Is the NFU a union for farm workers or is it only for wealthy land owners and big business?

[Richard 1234]

Been 'mulling' this over Mull!

 

 

 

It's not entirely accurate to describe my 'beef' as farmer bashing.... Quite the opposite if you accept the following, which I may have failed to articulate properly thus giving the impression, or allowing the interpretation to conclude it might be farmer bashing....

 

 

 

I think it's fairly accurate to say that the vast majority of my ranting has been against the system of subsidy (and associated concessions) rather than the activity of farming.

 

 

 

More accurately, the way in which the subsidy / concessions appear to be targeted to the advantage of the already very wealthy and perhaps those not actively engaged in working agriculture - to the distinct disadvantage of the smaller players - it certainly seems, that the bigger they are the more they benefit, the smaller they are the less they benefit where small seems to have greater direct connection to hands on work and larger has less.

 

 

 

Who's responsible for this? My interpretation is that it is wealthy land owners, the NFU, the CLA for example... All of which have considerable lobbying influence to maintain (and increase) the beneficial interests of the bigger players whilst brushing some crumbs aside to keep the plebs suckling at the teat of subsidy dependence and avoid a peasant uprising which would upset the gravy train.

 

 

 

I think it's beyond question that the ag sector operates in a considerably more favourable trading environment than any other UK business sector, that it is grossly inefficient and that, despite massive support, it actually contributes a piffling amount to GDP.

 

 

 

Despite this, I still, almost daily, have to listen to whining bustards telling me how hard they have it. It's amazing how quiet they go when I reel off the benefits they have over anyone else and, as often as not, I've already looked at their subsidy payments and that's when the bubble really bursts because a lot don't seem to know that it's open source information!

 

 

 

I don't include Richard and CS in that bracket because they both give a 'reality check' of the real life difficulty of making money in farming at the grass roots level. And that they do, is surely a reality check and example of exactly WHY the current system is inherently flawed. If only those IN the system would recognise the inequity rather than cling hopelessly to an ever decreasing share of what the big players have been living rich off for too long.

 

 

 

Rather than it being a question for the VOA Richard, perhaps it might be better levelled at the NFU? Why is this another example of support for larger / land owning farmers rather than smaller / perhaps tenant farmers? Is the NFU a union for farm workers or is it only for wealthy land owners and big business?

 

 

Maybe there could be some sort of sliding scale that falls to nothing based on either land size or production (though this is effectively the same thing).

In this system you would receive just for example £100 per acre up to 200 acres then £75 per acre for the next 200 and so on.

The figures would not work at those levels but the idea is possible. But if would never get through because of said massive farmer/landowners the NFU blah blah.

 

The GDP thing is misleading in this instance IMO as without food no one would be productive workers.

 

The subsidies also pale to insignificant figures when you start looking at other spending.

 

[https://www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/2013/jan/08/uk-benefit-welfare-spending#data/URL]

 

These are old figures but show what I'm getting at.

 

The system is broken and needs rethinking.

 

How much money is spent on defence? You could argue for cutting right back on that so we could not go bombing people in arguably illegal wars!

[Mull]

Been 'mulling' this over Mull!

 

 

 

It's not entirely accurate to describe my 'beef' as farmer bashing.... Quite the opposite if you accept the following, which I may have failed to articulate properly thus giving the impression, or allowing the interpretation to conclude it might be farmer bashing....

 

 

 

I think it's fairly accurate to say that the vast majority of my ranting has been against the system of subsidy (and associated concessions) rather than the activity of farming.

 

 

 

More accurately, the way in which the subsidy / concessions appear to be targeted to the advantage of the already very wealthy and perhaps those not actively engaged in working agriculture - to the distinct disadvantage of the smaller players - it certainly seems, that the bigger they are the more they benefit, the smaller they are the less they benefit where small seems to have greater direct connection to hands on work and larger has less.

 

 

 

Who's responsible for this? My interpretation is that it is wealthy land owners, the NFU, the CLA for example... All of which have considerable lobbying influence to maintain (and increase) the beneficial interests of the bigger players whilst brushing some crumbs aside to keep the plebs suckling at the teat of subsidy dependence and avoid a peasant uprising which would upset the gravy train.

 

 

 

I think it's beyond question that the ag sector operates in a considerably more favourable trading environment than any other UK business sector, that it is grossly inefficient and that, despite massive support, it actually contributes a piffling amount to GDP.

 

 

 

Despite this, I still, almost daily, have to listen to whining bustards telling me how hard they have it. It's amazing how quiet they go when I reel off the benefits they have over anyone else and, as often as not, I've already looked at their subsidy payments and that's when the bubble really bursts because a lot don't seem to know that it's open source information!

 

 

 

I don't include Richard and CS in that bracket because they both give a 'reality check' of the real life difficulty of making money in farming at the grass roots level. And that they do, is surely a reality check and example of exactly WHY the current system is inherently flawed. If only those IN the system would recognise the inequity rather than cling hopelessly to an ever decreasing share of what the big players have been living rich off for too long.

 

 

 

Rather than it being a question for the VOA Richard, perhaps it might be better levelled at the NFU? Why is this another example of support for larger / land owning farmers rather than smaller / perhaps tenant farmers? Is the NFU a union for farm workers or is it only for wealthy land owners and big business?

 

 

The farmer bashing comment wasn't a serious remark Kevin, as I'm sure you know. Your views are always pretty fair minded as far as I can see.

 

Big landowners as you say will have considerable influence on decisions and that will be the same everywhere that falls under CAP.

And then when renewables come in with wind turbines etc, whose in the ideal position to receive more of the "free money"?