Vat killing me!

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

It's all in here Kevin.

 

https://www.gov.uk/vat-flat-rate-scheme/how-much-you-pay

 

Cheers.....Al

 

 

Tree Surgeon - Woking | Cormack Tree Care Ltd

 

Got it, thanks!

 

Interesting stuff....

 

Spoke to accountant and VAT helpline about how to, and who, decides which 'type of business' and % rate is applicable.

 

According to VAT helpline it's a self nomination.

 

Looking at the list it would seem that any of the following might be appropriate:

 

Agricultural services - 11%

Business services NLE* - 12%

Estate agency / property management - 12%

Farming / Agriculture NLE* - 6.5%

Forestry / fishing - 10.5%

General building / construction services - 9.5%

Management consultancy - 14%

Real estate NLE* - 14%

 

(*NLE = Not listed elsewhere)

 

So, assuming a fairly equal spread of woodland management (forestry?), domestic arb (property management? / Real estate NLE?), commercial / site clearance (general building / construction services?) surveying / QTRA (Management consultancy?) hedging / stonewalling (Ag services or Ag NLE?) it could be anywhere between 6.5% and 14%?

 

Glad that's so clear and easy! I asked the VAT helpline if jobs that fit into different brackets should have VAT charged at the appropriate rate but they said you have 1 flat rate and stick to it.

 

Having been through the mill with these 'people', I asked what happens if someone comes along later and decides you've picked the wrong bracket.....

 

Tumbleweed......

 

So I guess I'll just fill in that info gap with the assumption you get bent over!

 

Domestic arb is not exactly forestry nor is it ag NLE but which is it most like??

 

Commercial arb is not exactly general building / construction nor is it real estate NLE but which is it most like?

 

Report writing / surveying / QTRA is not exactly business services NLE nor is it management consultancy but which is it most like....

 

Etc, etc, etc....

 

It's not an insignificant decision since there could be a substantial variation in VAT payable

 

An interesting observation in reading the table of applicable rates....

 

There's ANOTHER agricultural concession (6.5-11% VAT) that the rest of the trading nation don't get and that's on top of reduced council tax for farmhouses, rebated fuel, exemption from business rates, exemption from inheritance tax, exemption from planning regs and of course the free money. Must be tough getting so much of a leg up and still only managing to contribute 0.7% of UK GDP.

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

I can't see where it says tree surgery comes into forestry Al.

 

Am I missing something again?

 

Took me a bit longer since I was stuck on hold to VAT helpline!

[Gary Prentice]

Vat and helpline don't really go together do they?

[eggsarascal]

Took me a bit longer since I was stuck on hold to VAT helpline!

 

I feel your pain.

 

I had Over a hour on the phone to a Gov Dept yesterday.

 

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

Vat and helpline don't really go together do they?

 

It's early days, but initial indications are favourable....

 

I spoke to someone that seemed 'human' at HMRC yesterday!

 

It has taken 6 months to even get a response from a written complaint though, but now he's on the case it looks promising with his opening gambit being "I can't see how he (the original desk officer) has come to that conclusion and I'm going to need to look closely at his work...!" To which I replied "neither could the judge that overruled him at Tribunal, so why am I still having to deal with this idiot?"

 

He was in the complaints department, I hope they are feared and loathed by the regular desk officers something akin to the police internal investigations branch!

[Justme]

Got it, thanks!

 

that's on top of reduced council tax for farmhouses,

 

Do they?

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

Do they?

 

Farmers could receive £14,000 council tax rebate - Farmers Weekly

 

Valuation Office Agency - Council Tax Manual

[Al Cormack]

I went with what my accountant said.

Forestry and arb are both tree related industries.

 

 

http://www.cormacktreecare.co.uk

[Richard 1234]

Got it, thanks!

 

 

 

Interesting stuff....

 

 

 

Spoke to accountant and VAT helpline about how to, and who, decides which 'type of business' and % rate is applicable.

 

 

 

According to VAT helpline it's a self nomination.

 

 

 

Looking at the list it would seem that any of the following might be appropriate:

 

 

 

Agricultural services - 11%

 

Business services NLE* - 12%

 

Estate agency / property management - 12%

 

Farming / Agriculture NLE* - 6.5%

 

Forestry / fishing - 10.5%

 

General building / construction services - 9.5%

 

Management consultancy - 14%

 

Real estate NLE* - 14%

 

 

 

(*NLE = Not listed elsewhere)

 

 

 

So, assuming a fairly equal spread of woodland management (forestry?), domestic arb (property management? / Real estate NLE?), commercial / site clearance (general building / construction services?) surveying / QTRA (Management consultancy?) hedging / stonewalling (Ag services or Ag NLE?) it could be anywhere between 6.5% and 14%?

 

 

 

Glad that's so clear and easy! I asked the VAT helpline if jobs that fit into different brackets should have VAT charged at the appropriate rate but they said you have 1 flat rate and stick to it.

 

 

 

Having been through the mill with these 'people', I asked what happens if someone comes along later and decides you've picked the wrong bracket.....

 

 

 

Tumbleweed......

 

 

 

So I guess I'll just fill in that info gap with the assumption you get bent over!

 

 

 

Domestic arb is not exactly forestry nor is it ag NLE but which is it most like??

 

 

 

Commercial arb is not exactly general building / construction nor is it real estate NLE but which is it most like?

 

 

 

Report writing / surveying / QTRA is not exactly business services NLE nor is it management consultancy but which is it most like....

 

 

 

Etc, etc, etc....

 

 

 

It's not an insignificant decision since there could be a substantial variation in VAT payable

 

 

 

An interesting observation in reading the table of applicable rates....

 

 

 

There's ANOTHER agricultural concession (6.5-11% VAT) that the rest of the trading nation don't get and that's on top of reduced council tax for farmhouses, rebated fuel, exemption from business rates, exemption from inheritance tax, exemption from planning regs and of course the free money. Must be tough getting so much of a leg up and still only managing to contribute 0.7% of UK GDP.

 

 

And yet with all that if you don't own the land outright you will not make any money!!

 

I think all farmers should stop work and live on this huge amount of money they have been given.........

It's a shame we would starve in the process

[eggsarascal]

And yet with all that if you don't own the land outright you will not make any money!!

 

I think all farmers should stop work and live on this huge amount of money they have been given.........

It's a shame we would starve in the process

 

This is another one of those ill thought out comments.

 

Farmers rent land all over the place and make money from it.