Climbing VS Access platform

[AA Teccie (Paul)]

Excellent study!!!!

 

For me that says it all!! (although I would argue with the "safety" in the con list for climbing, as thats debatable, IMO.)

 

I still hate MEWP's and would only use one as a last resort.

 

Hey 'Skyhuck', hope you're well.

 

I'm sure your posts will come as music to the ears of "ms660isthebest", and, as a former climber myself (albeit many moons ago...shhh!) I wholly understand your take on it, in particular "use it or lose it" (applied to many things in life!)

 

However things have moved on, particularly since the advent of the W@H Regs, and I was pleased to read your final sentence about you would use one as a last resort...in other words you wouldn't compromise your personal safety.

 

Bottom line, that's what it's about.

 

Take care out there... "Mr not-so-young-as-you-used-to-be"....but still going strong, ha!

 

Cheers,

Paul

[kimtree]

when i started treework in Aus in 2004 i couldnt agree more with the original poster,just climb it

 

however after a couple of years climbing in 40+ degree heat and high humidity i realized that if i was to continue in this line of work i was going to have to work smarter not harder.so i bought a nifty 17 metre mewp

 

Access problems are not an issue here most yards can be accessed by a trailer lift

on the other hand have had many issues trying to get good ground staff here so have(no one wants to work ) bought machinery instead

 

 

i dont climb much now and i dont suffer from nasty cramp like i did when i was climbing either

[skyhuck]

Hey 'Skyhuck', hope you're well.

 

I'm sure your posts will come as music to the ears of "ms660isthebest", and, as a former climber myself (albeit many moons ago...shhh!) I wholly understand your take on it, in particular "use it or lose it" (applied to many things in life!)

 

However things have moved on, particularly since the advent of the W@H Regs, and I was pleased to read your final sentence about you would use one as a last resort...in other words you wouldn't compromise your personal safety.

 

Bottom line, that's what it's about.

 

Take care out there... "Mr not-so-young-as-you-used-to-be"....but still going strong, ha!

 

Cheers,

Paul

 

Hi Paul I'm very well thanks

 

In my head I'm still 15

 

Hope your well too

[Mesterh]

"ms660isthebest" is a young, very fit and very strong guy...my hand is still recovering form his hand shake.

 

IN addition to his posting he also made the very valid point that if your not climbing on a regular basis your skills and competnece will start to wane...fair comment!

 

However, sorry, but I feel compelled to state the H&S position on this:

 

Basically the work at height regs contain a hierarchy of access for undertaking work at height and the practical application for our industry is

1. Ground level, i.e. straight fell / pole pruners etc.

2. MEWP - has collective protective (meaning all who enter into the bucket are automtcially prevneted from falling from height by the guardrails etc.) AND must be considered ahead of individual protective measures.

3. Tree climbing / work positioning.

 

Bottom line, i order to demonstarte compliance iwht the regs, you must be able to show this is the approach you take to tree work at height as a business (hence that is why the AA risk assessment form set outs his heirarchy).

 

IF use of the MEWP does not meet the 'reasonably practicable' test, in other words if the additional cost is disproportionate to the increase in safety, then it can be factored out, i.e. 300 quid job involving a good tree with good anchors and a routine operation whihc could be safely climbed AND the MEWP would add another 200 quid, that would be deemed disproportionate, i.e. increase in cost doesn;'t achieve corresponding increase in safety. However there may be other factors involvong efficiency measures that dictate a MEWP is the best option.

 

Alternatively it may be the 'risk level' asociated with using a MEWP is above that involved in climbing. Interesting HSE have recentlt reported many accidents involving crush injuries by perosn in MEWPs.

 

Won;t waffle anymore BUT, if you're interested, there is a 'Treework at Height' policy / procedure doc. on the AA web resource at Help becoming an ARB Approved Contractor

 

Cheers all..

Paul

 

Excellent bit of info and thankls for that.

 

 

I thought cost wasnt a factor, it would factor out a MEWP in probably 99.999999% of all my work.

 

A MEWP is I think a great piece of kit as mentioned by others just like a crane, ie in the right circumstances.

 

I have only used a MEWP on a handful of occasions in my work (loads of times when subbing to others) the main reason being the job spec.

 

I have costed in a MEWP when ime I think the work couldnt be carried out by the standard rope,harness day to day tree climbing op.

 

The main reason for not using a MEWP is cost to me,I would rather the job took longer and more of the money went into my business than a hire company.

 

Obviously this would change if I had more work than I could handle and speed of job completion would increase.

 

Why pay someone £500 for the hire of a crane/mewp then have your men twiddling their thumbs and not earning the next day.

 

I dont see the argument that mewps are more dangerous if by definition tree work isnt dangerous.

[WoodED]

Hi everyone

 

I have been on AA risk assement course today. A big issue i was putting across was climbing was faster, better ,cheaper,more enjoyable and the right way to do tree work. Unless the tree was dead or dangerous to climb. However the fellow Arborists was mainly going for the platform. In my eyes its for people who can t climb or being lazy.

 

I wondered what your thoughts are on this?

 

Cheers

 

agreed with climbing is more enjoyable and all the rest stated,, but if its in terms of health n saftey, a platform is doing less strain to your body, but still wouldnt use one unless its a dangerous tree

[R A HACKETT]

i,ve got a 26m 7.5t lorry mount 13m outreach and an 18m tracked spider lift 11m outreach once these are in place they are faster than any climber

i do a lot of work for other firms and this has been proven many times

also they are safer with sectional dismantling as you can use the cage as an anchor point [light stuff]

i know its not as aesthetically pleasing and doesnt require the fitness and rigging training. but with the technology of the modern machines if it is within your budget then it has to be considered

furthermore your groundworker only has to know the safety lowering and not be rescue trained [climbing]

i do have my climbing and recue tickets but age and speed are against me

[skyhuck]

i,ve got a 26m 7.5t lorry mount 13m outreach and an 18m tracked spider lift 11m outreach once these are in place they are faster than any climber

i do a lot of work for other firms and this has been proven many times

also they are safer with sectional dismantling as you can use the cage as an anchor point [light stuff]i know its not as aesthetically pleasing and doesnt require the fitness and rigging training. but with the technology of the modern machines if it is within your budget then it has to be considered

furthermore your groundworker only has to know the safety lowering and not be rescue trained [climbing]

i do have my climbing and recue tickets but age and speed are against me

 

To be fair, the kind of people that hire you in are not likely to have the most skilled/efficient climbers, making then not the quickest

 

And to suggest that rigging from the basket makes if safer than climbing is quite unbelievable

[Taupotreeman]

Much as I am happy to endorse the use of EPV's, MEWP's or whatever you wish to call them, rigging from them is a wholly bad idea. I was always taught never to use them for rigging, lifting, craining etc. They are designed for one purpose and most usually have a safe working load for a reason. Personally, I wouldn't use an EPV that I know had been used by someone else for rigging etc. In fibre glass booms it has been known to cause hairline fractures which can lead to a catastrophic failure of the boom if it isn't picked up by daily check, acoustic testing etc.

[Matt Butler]

we have 2 27m tracked, a 27m lorry mount, and three smaller machines, love them to bits:001_smile:

 

in most cases i think they are quicker, safer, and can achieve a better finish than even a very efficient climber,

 

Don't mean to argue, just my own humble opinion:thumbup:

[geoff]

I go with hand helds from a basket,but would never ever rig anything from it (using the mewp as an anchor).

I did a trial on some reasonable sized lime re- pollards last week,climber versus mewp & there was nothing in it time wise,but there are some situations that render the mewp way more efficient.