Will a lot of small domestic tree firms go bust?

[Sviatoslav Tulin]

To my experience, big companies going bust much faster, than any 1 or 2man gang, so dream more. 

[coppice cutter]

There's a big international haulage company not far from me, been going thirty odd years.

 

 

Two brothers raised on a farm, started driving lorries, set up on their own, one brother hit the drink, other brother bought him out and kept building the company to the scale it is now.

 

Still operates as a sole trader.

 

I take it that you should understand how both work and choose the one that you think suits you best, I don't think there's any hard and fast "one is better than the other".

 

 

 

[JaySmith]

13 hours ago, kevinjohnsonmbe said:

Generally agree - but very much share Mick’s Go quick go home mantra. 
 

A healthy dose of ‘not too bothered’ combined with the ability to switch between operations and consultancy works (useful for rainy days anyway) 

 

I am genuinely hoping things do quieten down. I desperately want a bloody good holiday after all the covid nonsense and travel disruption. 
 

Keep your overheads low and there’s nothing to worry about. 

I certainly agree about keeping the costs low, that way it allows you to whether the storm better as you haven’t got larger monthly outgoings. I used to work for a small firm with three crews and the boss didn’t finance anything, it meant if things slowed down he was able to ride things out. He also did consultancy so had an alternative income as well. 
 

We’ve all seen it over the years when things drop off firms with significant exposure or limited order books drop the day rate which leads to a spiral to the bottom. A real balancing act between paying the bills, keeping the guys busy and making some profit. Sustainability.   

 

I also agree it will be good if things slow a little. Since covid things have been mad, people were at home spending money on their property which meant all trades were crazily busy and as a yet there hasn’t been a correction. 
 

 

 

[Barney]

When we went through the 2008 recession, i can't think of any tree firms in my area that went bust. They're all still out there now and they probably will be in years to come. I'm a small, domestic comany and feeling positive!

[Mike Hill]

I have noticed it a bit even in wealthy Norway.Its been the interest rate hike that has put the brakes on peoples spending more than anything.Also people are less patient than before,meaning that now if I dont return that call untill the evening,they may have found another firm.That is especially frustrating when the caller might have been a repeat client.

 

On the other hand,I have been operating without any form of advertising apart from sign written vehicles for about 18 months and to be honest it has increased my conversion rate as well as my day rate while still remaining busy. I put that down to people seeking out the company directly rather than Googling "Tree Felling " and picking the top three companies. I used to do alot of miles quoting jobs where people were simply curious about how much it would cost.

 

I can see a number of new companies without broad customer bases shutting up shop.That is simply a symptom of market retraction.

 

As an asside: Wouldnt it be fun to see how many Tree Surgery Companies there are now in the UK compared to 1982 for example,to see how that number has increased in contrast to population growth.

[JaySmith]

1 hour ago, Mike Hill said:

As an asside: Wouldnt it be fun to see how many Tree Surgery Companies there are now in the UK compared to 1982 for example,to see how that number has increased in contrast to population growth.

That would be interesting to see. I’m in the South East and every other truck on the A2/A20 in the morning seems to have a chipper behind it. What would also be interesting to see is how the structure of firms have changed, for example there seems to be less of the three or four crew firms out there and lots of one man bands who all sub to each other and help each other out on bigger jobs that the larger firms used to do. I think this has been a byproduct of cheap finance and lots of freelance climbers bitting the bullet and buying trucks and chippers instead of just freelance climbing. 

[Mike Hill]

21 minutes ago, JaySmith said:

That would be interesting to see. I’m in the South East and every other truck on the A2/A20 in the morning seems to have a chipper behind it. What would also be interesting to see is how the structure of firms have changed, for example there seems to be less of the three or four crew firms out there and lots of one man bands who all sub to each other and help each other out on bigger jobs that the larger firms used to do. I think this has been a byproduct of cheap finance and lots of freelance climbers bitting the bullet and buying trucks and chippers instead of just freelance climbing. 

Good point.

 

I think the smart phone and social media has had a big part to play in this too.

 

I have a big job coming up, I need a few subbies , I organised all this in minutes with pictures of the job and set it in my digital calander.

[Sutton]

I know of two firms here who use virtual secretaries. So a potential customer phones up for a site visit etc and speaks to a lady who knows very little about the business but takes all the details. She then passes it on the owners who follow up with a return call in their own time.

Virtual secretaries can have many firms on their books - some in the same business!

So you have to trust it works.

It wouldn't be much of a stretch to see virtual secretraries morphing into freelance agencies sooner or later.

Think of the possibilities...

Edited October 25, 2022 by Sutton

[doobin]

33 minutes ago, Sutton said:

I know of two firms here who use virtual secretaries. So a potential customer phones up for a site visit etc and speaks to a lady who knows very little about the business but takes all the details. She then passes it on the owners who follow up with a return call in their own time.

Virtual secretaries can have many firms on their books - some in the same business!

So you have to trust it works.

It wouldn't be much of a stretch to see virtual secretraries morphing into freelance agencies sooner or later.

Think of the possibilities...

It's really obvious when a firm is using a vitual secretary, and I don't think it's a good look.

[Sutton]

5 minutes ago, doobin said:

It's really obvious when a firm is using a vitual secretary, and I don't think it's a good look.

I agree. I'm just saying in the context of belt-tightening there are options.

 

Here's a non-arb example of a difficult secretay.

 

I phoned up a quarry wanting to buy 10ton of limestone for tracks (not grey scalpings) and asked about an option for dust and fines mixed with small rejects rather than clean stone, The secretary wasn't too helpful. She went round in circles along the lines of "I've never been asked that before so I'm sure you can't have it and even if you could I'm too busy to find out". 🤣 She was based in an office in another city. I got another number of the quarry direct. "No problem that's £5 a ton when do you want to collect?"