Scotland and dictator Sturgeon

[openspaceman]

32 minutes ago, Woodworks said:

It's all a complicated equation. Our second system is at the supposed optimum angle of 36 degrees also supposedly the best panels at the time (Sanyo) Interestingly the 15 degree system out produces the 36 degree system annually. It's hard to be sure of all the reasons for this. There is a little bit of shading late in the day and shading is killer without micro inverters or what ever the equivalent these days but I doubt this account for all of the difference. The other aspect is our localised weather conditions. Being on the very west of Dartmoor we get a lot more cloud than places just 5 miles away. Interestingly a system at 0 degrees is more productive than any other angle when it's cloudy or overcast as the light is diffracted straight down through the clouds. A another thing to consider is an east west system should produce around 80% of a due south system with all other things being equal but morning and evening are times many of us are more likely to be in and able to use that production. 

 

When it was all about getting money from the FIT most opted for the max production per year but when you are looking at personal usage there are more things to consider. 

Yes I understand all those things and also did think that a bright but overcast day would trump shallow direct sunlight but now I know it doesn't, not much one can do about that aspect.

 

Why didn't we discuss this in a renewable energy thread??

[openspaceman]

22 minutes ago, Woodworks said:

I once saw a map that showed actual PV production per kWh installed. The best areas were in an arc starting from Exeter going up to Bristol and coming down near Eastbourne.

Well I am in that area and seem to produce about 3MWh pa out of my SW facing 4kW panels, they do not come into full sunlight before 10:00 GMT and trees shade out the end of the day in WNW.

[Sutton]

28 minutes ago, Woodworks said:

I dont have the details on the installation date to hand but think its around 10-11 years ago. It was right at the beginning of the FIT system. The panels are REC . The inverter is an SMA which is still going strong and never had a fault. We have no record of what gets used on site and what was exported as the early system had none of todays Bluetooth connectivity to follow these things. 

 

As for Devon getting lots more sun thats not quite the case and just an illusion put out by the local tourist board IMO 😆.  I once saw a map that showed actual PV production per kWh installed. The best areas were in an arc starting from Exeter going up to Bristol and coming down near Eastbourne. Then there was an area around the Wash that was super productive.

Thanks.
Google says Devon gets 1550hrs of sunshine per year of 8760hrs.
So given your average of 4065kwh per year,
and
Google saying:
A typical domestic household in the UK consumes 3,100KWh of electricity per year,
you're doing well.

When I did my sums 12 years ago, the cost of a 3000kw install was £14k.
The panels were warranted for 25 years but were only 20% efficient and our tariff at the time put daytime electric unit per kw at 11p.
Things have changed!

[Stere]

Any guess-timate calcs of how  the payback time of a PV system with the addtional battery storage compares to the same one  without?

 

 

Ecomony 7  also could charge battery?

 

Edited February 7, 2022 by Stere

[openspaceman]

3 hours ago, Sutton said:

When I did my sums 12 years ago, the cost of a 3000kw install was £14k.
The panels were warranted for 25 years but were only 20% efficient and our tariff at the time put daytime electric unit per kw at 11p.
Things have changed!

Mine was 4kW and £13k about then, never worked out the efficiency as it's meaningless in this context. The price dropped to about half within 3 or 4 years I'm told. I'm glad you remembered your electricity price per kWh then at 11p, certainly puts things into context.

Edited February 7, 2022 by openspaceman
spelling

[openspaceman]

46 minutes ago, Stere said:

Any guess-timate calcs of how  the payback time of a PV system with the addtional battery storage compares to the same one  without?

 

 

 

 

I never really kept proper records, I just knew my electricity bill was low at £240 pa, The firm that installed my battery for £3k reckoned I would go from 60% independence from the grid to 80%, I hope to do better, but that 20% difference in importing from the grid may represent £168 saved so just short of 6% of the cost pa.

 

It will never payback in my lifetime unless I get a cheap night time tariff for the winter even then it's a toss up whether the battery (guaranteed 7 years) will outlast me.

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

32 minutes ago, openspaceman said:

I never really kept proper records, I just knew my electricity bill was low at £240 pa, The firm that installed my battery for £3k reckoned I would go from 60% independence from the grid to 80%, I hope to do better, but that 20% difference in importing from the grid may represent £168 saved so just short of 6% of the cost pa.

 

It will never payback in my lifetime unless I get a cheap night time tariff for the winter even then it's a toss up whether the battery (guaranteed 7 years) will outlast me.

There’s ‘pure’ figures and then there’s the ‘worth’ of personal satisfaction of knowing you have reduced your contribution to corporate profit of energy companies. 
 

Can a value even be put on that?

 

Of course (if it even exists outside of my twisted economic logic) everyone would add different (if any) weight to those elements of justification which don’t fit in a spreadsheet. 
 

Mad really, the figures need to be there or thereabouts, or at least not too far out - but I still ‘feel’ like I want a battery system. 

[billy_wizz]

15 minutes ago, kevinjohnsonmbe said:

There’s ‘pure’ figures and then there’s the ‘worth’ of personal satisfaction of knowing you have reduced your contribution to corporate profit of energy companies. 
 

Can a value even be put on that?

 

Of course (if it even exists outside of my twisted economic logic) everyone would add different (if any) weight to those elements of justification which don’t fit in a spreadsheet. 
 

Mad really, the figures need to be there or thereabouts, or at least not too far out - but I still ‘feel’ like I want a battery system. 

I think you will find that alot of solar companies are tied in with energy companies so you will still be giving to corporate profits of energy companies just from a different direction!

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

15 minutes ago, billy_wizz said:

I think you will find that alot of solar companies are tied in with energy companies so you will still be giving to corporate profits of energy companies just from a different direction!

I was thinking more along the lines energy required in panel production process but that’s what I mean when I say we all have ways and means of making the available information ‘fit’ the justification of our actions.....

Edited February 7, 2022 by kevinjohnsonmbe

[Macpherson]

15 hours ago, david wood said:

thats true electric prices are getting horrible,    now i know sod all about solar so i hate to imagine how many panels to be worth it,   can they go on a garage roof instead of house?     garage roof only has about 20 degree slope,   hate thought of adding to house roof as its a windy site and dont want to compromise roof structure any.

 

its all a totally new topic to me so any folks with an idiots guide please post,

 

I'm planning to put 4kw of panels on a ground based mount in the garden, at least then I can maintain them, It would be a right bugger if you had a roof problem under the panels.

I recently read that optimum angle ranges from 30* in the south of England to 40* in northern Scotland and facing south but I'm no expert, I've just been looking into it and trying to decide whether to try to diy it or get a company in to quote for it.

There's an 'off grid ' thread running on here where quite a few have loads of experience of this, cheers.

 

I guess I should have read the last couple of pages before posting, but I did say there was a lot of folk on here with much knowledge 🙄

Edited February 7, 2022 by Macpherson