Lanyard in to cut on twin rope ?

[Rob Thompson]

PLEASE DO NOT DERAIL THE THREAD !!! (I'm aware of this sort of topic going a bit divided...)

I'm asking anyone who knows, weather the new rules (That I know a lot of people hate) require a climber to lanyard in to make a cut when on twin ropes ? I'd of thought that two ropes was enough !

I was up a thin today, there were so many cuts to make, that I abandoned the use of my side strop in favour of two systems.

It was a bit like the old days, just climbing around cutting stuff. I never did strop in or have a second line back then, but I generally would have my back to my anchor and blakes.

So does anyone profess to know the law on such things. I'd just like to know weather I'm being naughty or not ! Two systems AND a side strop seems a bit much to me 🤷‍♂️

Tia, Rob.

[Paddy1000111]

Basically no, there's nothing written in the stones of HSE saying you must have a lanyard attached during cutting. It says:

 

Rope access and positioning should only be used if there are at least two separately anchored lines - one the working line and the other a safety line. The user must be connected to both lines using a suitable harness. The working line should be equipped with a safe means of ascent and descent and have a self-locking design to prevent the user falling if they lose control. The safety line must be equipped with a mobile fall protection system connected to, and travelling with, the user of the system. 

 

The afag guidance (401) says:

 

Climbers need to carry an adjustable lanyard to provide, when appropriate, a

secondary anchor to prevent the risk of pendulum swing. Lanyards are a key part of

a tree-climbing system and have many uses, particularly as a supplementary load-

bearing anchor point when working in the crown or when changing anchor points.

Lanyards need to be adjustable to provide sufficient support to the climber.

The side attachment points on a harness are designed for support (eg where the

feet are on a branch or other part of the tree) but not suspension. Some harnesses

provide forward attachment points suitable for suspension. It is important to consult

the manufacturer’s instructions for the harness.

Do not attach the lanyard to one side alone.

 

I can't find anything anywhere saying you must have a positional strop attached when using a saw. 

[Rob Thompson]

1 hour ago, Paddy1000111 said:

Basically no, there's nothing written in the stones of HSE saying you must have a lanyard attached during cutting. It says:

 

Rope access and positioning should only be used if there are at least two separately anchored lines - one the working line and the other a safety line. The user must be connected to both lines using a suitable harness. The working line should be equipped with a safe means of ascent and descent and have a self-locking design to prevent the user falling if they lose control. The safety line must be equipped with a mobile fall protection system connected to, and travelling with, the user of the system. 

 

The afag guidance (401) says:

 

Climbers need to carry an adjustable lanyard to provide, when appropriate, a

secondary anchor to prevent the risk of pendulum swing. Lanyards are a key part of

a tree-climbing system and have many uses, particularly as a supplementary load-

bearing anchor point when working in the crown or when changing anchor points.

Lanyards need to be adjustable to provide sufficient support to the climber.

The side attachment points on a harness are designed for support (eg where the

feet are on a branch or other part of the tree) but not suspension. Some harnesses

provide forward attachment points suitable for suspension. It is important to consult

the manufacturer’s instructions for the harness.

Do not attach the lanyard to one side alone.

 

I can't find anything anywhere saying you must have a positional strop attached when using a saw. 

Thank you Paddy1000111, that clears thing up nicely 👍.

I must say, that where multiple cuts are to be made, two systems are superior to a lanyard. I enjoyed todays climb, never thought I could have so much fun up a bunch of ivy clad sycamores !!!

[Con]

Is it ok to derail the thread now?

[Paddy1000111]

15 minutes ago, Con said:

Is it ok to derail the thread now?

Go for it. It's going to go at some point 😂😂

[Stubby]

11 minutes ago, Paddy1000111 said:

Go for it. It's going to go at some point 😂😂

Whats your favorite pizza ?

[Pete Mctree]

Are you using one system as a backup & the other for working off, or are you using them both for work positioning? Are you likely to take an uncontrolled swing if you loose your footing or are cutting in such a way that there is a potential to damage one of your lines? Lots of questions that go beyond a set of rules & regs. You need to apply common sense to any approach in interpreting them

[Rob Thompson]

50 minutes ago, Pete Mctree said:

Are you using one system as a backup & the other for working off, or are you using them both for work positioning? Are you likely to take an uncontrolled swing if you loose your footing or are cutting in such a way that there is a potential to damage one of your lines? Lots of questions that go beyond a set of rules & regs. You need to apply common sense to any approach in interpreting them

I get that, I really do understand.

Because I've taken to using a new system (srt), I've taken it upon myself to learn the rules and acquire training.

Much like when I did my tickets all that time ago, once furnished with the right technique, we learn more with experience. I just wanted to know what 'the man' had to say on the matter.

I have a very nice lanyard, and I'm not afraid to use it !!!

[Rob Thompson]

1 hour ago, Con said:

Is it ok to derail the thread now?

Crack on ! I just wanted my answer before the thread descended in to the 'ol twin rope argument' !

[Khriss]

2 hours ago, Stubby said:

Whats your favorite pizza ?

Gotta be black forest. K

 

( would use lanyard as well if it eased yr work position fr a cut, but not obsessively, i would also be using full chisel chain)