Stoves and indoor pollution

[Billhook]

12 hours ago, Paddy1000111 said:

It's horses for courses I guess! I've not had a gas hob in about 8 years! The old electric cookers were garbage but the newer induction hobs are amazing. The boost function is incredible and will heat a saucepan quicker than any gas hob. If I want to fry a steak I put oil in a pan, hit boost and in about 5 seconds its smoking and ready for the meat! I can boil a saucepan of water faster than using the kettle. I also like that I can quickly wipe off a spill or throw a tea towel or wooden spoon down next to the pan without it starting a fire. Also no chance in it being left on or leaking, I take the saucepan away and it's off. I can also put something on a timer and let it stew on a low temp for 2 hours and switch itself off. The childlock stops small hands messing with things. 

 

There's no winner here, but I know what I prefer! 

Call me old fashioned, but my ancestors have been cooking on open flames for several million years.  I expect your induction steaks to keep inducting once they are inside you and will eventually induct your brain and fry it!

[Paddy1000111]

1 hour ago, Billhook said:

Call me old fashioned, but my ancestors have been cooking on open flames for several million years.  I expect your induction steaks to keep inducting once they are inside you and will eventually induct your brain and fry it!

I get the theory, people said the same about microwaves but that isn't how science works! 

[openspaceman]

10 hours ago, Paddy1000111 said:

Probably that plus the drop in air temperature bringing particulate matter that's risen in the day to drop maybe?

I put that wrongly,  it's particulates that increase during the evening.

 

As it was raining steadily this morning I sampled the outside air, expecting some of the particulates to have washed out but I got figures of ~7μg/m^3 for PM2.5 and 10.5μg/m^3 for PM10, inside the figures were about 2μg/m^3 PM2.5 and 9μg/m^3 PM 10.

 

Bearing in mind PM2.5 are a subset of PM 10 in this device it shows how the smaller particles are almost certainly smoke.

 

There was a big spike of PM10 as I moved the device and then several spikes as I ashed out the stove, all predominatly PM10. So I think that my thought that moving around acauses larger ash particles to be lofted is likely.

 

A long time ago someone,  @kevinjohnsonmbe I believe, had a fine filter for indoor air to reduce a family member's allergies? Anyway it is something I am considering but I want to try and make my own.

 

Yes Kevin I have little doubt air changes in supermarkets are too low and some of this will be due to costs of all the lost heat unless they have whole building air heat recovery. I haven't been to a supermarket for a year ( spend a bit more at the corner shop where there are seldom other customers) my wife gets the occasional delivery but as with tube stations, buses and railway carriages I would expect them to be hot spots of virus.

 

I still don't know how efficiently a virus could be filtered out.

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

10 minutes ago, openspaceman said:

 

A long time ago someone,  @kevinjohnsonmbe I believe, had a fine filter for indoor air to reduce a family member's allergies?

Yes that was (and still is) my method OSM. Dyson thingy (much to @Khriss ‘s displeasure 😂)

 

 

[Khriss]

So running a HEPA filtering 2Kw Dyson was yr solution  😲  K

[Paddy1000111]

19 minutes ago, openspaceman said:

I put that wrongly,  it's particulates that increase during the evening.

 

As it was raining steadily this morning I sampled the outside air, expecting some of the particulates to have washed out but I got figures of ~7μg/m^3 for PM2.5 and 10.5μg/m^3 for PM10, inside the figures were about 2μg/m^3 PM2.5 and 9μg/m^3 PM 10.

 

Bearing in mind PM2.5 are a subset of PM 10 in this device it shows how the smaller particles are almost certainly smoke.

 

There was a big spike of PM10 as I moved the device and then several spikes as I ashed out the stove, all predominantly PM10. So I think that my thought that moving around causes larger ash particles to be lofted is likely.

 

A long time ago someone,  @kevinjohnsonmbe I believe, had a fine filter for indoor air to reduce a family member's allergies? Anyway it is something I am considering but I want to try and make my own.

 

Yes Kevin I have little doubt air changes in supermarkets are too low and some of this will be due to costs of all the lost heat unless they have whole building air heat recovery. I haven't been to a supermarket for a year ( spend a bit more at the corner shop where there are seldom other customers) my wife gets the occasional delivery but as with tube stations, buses and railway carriages I would expect them to be hot spots of virus.

 

I still don't know how efficiently a virus could be filtered out.

Sorry, I got what you meant! I meant that maybe the smaller particulates float up into the atmosphere and away from the sensors as temperature rises and then start to come down and towards the sensors as the temperature drops?

 

I found humidity effects my asthma more than dust, I have a dehumidifier with a filter on it. It has a UV sterilisation light inside too but I don't think that does anything to the air, more likely reduces the chances of mildew growing on the coils. 

 

In terms of filtering for covid, coronavirus particles are about 0.06-0.14 microns. Hepa filters only filter down to 0.3 microns and ULPA filters down to 0.12 microns. All you can really filter out is the larger particles created by someone sneezing and keeping air fresh and flowing instead of stationary so particles can't be held. 

[sime42]

I put that wrongly,  it's particulates that increase during the evening.
 
As it was raining steadily this morning I sampled the outside air, expecting some of the particulates to have washed out but I got figures of ~7μg/m^3 for PM2.5 and 10.5μg/m^3 for PM10, inside the figures were about 2μg/m^3 PM2.5 and 9μg/m^3 PM 10.
 
Bearing in mind PM2.5 are a subset of PM 10 in this device it shows how the smaller particles are almost certainly smoke.
 
There was a big spike of PM10 as I moved the device and then several spikes as I ashed out the stove, all predominatly PM10. So I think that my thought that moving around acauses larger ash particles to be lofted is likely.
 
A long time ago someone,  @kevinjohnsonmbe I believe, had a fine filter for indoor air to reduce a family member's allergies? Anyway it is something I am considering but I want to try and make my own.
 
Yes Kevin I have little doubt air changes in supermarkets are too low and some of this will be due to costs of all the lost heat unless they have whole building air heat recovery. I haven't been to a supermarket for a year ( spend a bit more at the corner shop where there are seldom other customers) my wife gets the occasional delivery but as with tube stations, buses and railway carriages I would expect them to be hot spots of virus.
 
I still don't know how efficiently a virus could be filtered out.

Wrt to your comments about PM10 spikes when you ashed out the stove. I've been seeing special purpose ash vacuum cleaners around for a while now, but just dismissed them as another gimmick. I'm now wondering if they are actually worth while, if they stop the finer particles being blown out into the room. (Presumably they've special fine filters).
I normally just use the trusty Henry hoover to clear up any loose ash and other debris around the wood burner. I use HEPA filters in it, (purely by chance as that was all I could get last time I bought them), and having just looked it up they should block PM2.5 stuff and even smaller. So we should be ok.
Any thoughts on this?

[Paddy1000111]

Just now, sime42 said:

Wrt to your comments about PM10 spikes when you ashed out the stove. I've been seeing special purpose ash vacuum cleaners around for a while now, but just dismissed them as another gimmick. I'm now wondering if they are actually worth while, if they stop the finer particles being blown out into the room. (Presumably they've special fine filters).
I normally just use the trusty Henry hoover to clear up any loose ash and other debris around the wood burner. I use HEPA filters in it, (purely by chance as that was all I could get last time I bought them), and having just looked it up they should block PM2.5 stuff and even smaller. So we should be ok.
Any thoughts on this?
 

A henry with the correct filter will stop pm10 and pm2.5. I don't think there's any difference between a henry and an ash hoover apart from the name! 

[sime42]

And probably the price! I bought my Henry as second hand and reconditioned for £80. It was a while ago so it's got the old more powerful motor as well. It's a hungry monster of a hoover!

[peatff]

Once our fire is lit it doesn't make smoke and if there is any it goes up the chimney with the draw from the warm air. I rattle the ash into the bottom pan then lift it out and put the box I made over it so it doesn't get in the house. I use a little rechargeable vacuum for the hearth and tip it all on the garden and dig it in.

Edited January 14, 2021 by peatff