How do you air dry your wood down to 20% ??

[trigger_andy]

I am not disputing what you say Andy but this is all culture, and local convenience etc.  The reality is how effective a firewood is has nothing to do with whether it is softwood or hardwood,  Well actually that is not quite true - softwood gives slightly more heat per kilo once dry.  But this is all irrelevant compared to the one thing that matters - how dry it is.  And this is why people think Ash is so good - because it dries so easily.  In fact it has half the water in that most woods do when freshly felled. 
 
But as we can't all have Ash what it really comes down to is moisture, and this is where the softwoods score - they dry really fast.  So from a commercial point of view I would rather sell softwood as it is much easier to process and dry.  I would happily argue with customers and tell them they would be daft to stick with hardwood.  I am currently converting my customers to briquettes as I have stopped firewood altogether.  There is a lot of resistance initially, but most people now are coming back for seconds and thirds.

Big J was referring to what he believes is a mainly UK negative attitude to Softwood, I was just pointing out my own observations on that differ and from what I’ve seen the UK has a similar outlook on softwood as many other countries.

I’ll be logging up a lot of softwood from my plot this year and look forward to mixing it in with my hardwood.

I’ll also be installing my Ironheart in the kitchen so it will be nice to have some “kitchen wood” handy. ?

[trigger_andy]

Just now, Big J said:

I used to have a Jotul type stove at our last house in Scotland and it was my understanding that they were designed to work best with softwood. Given that that was most of what I burned, it worked very well. 

If you remember the model number we can investigate the user manual.  

 

Just now, Big J said:

I produce some fairly tidy hardwood firewood. Several thousand tonnes a year. That being said, when I look at the stacks at roadside next to the softwood 2.5s (same price roadside), I can only see that it would take 4 times as long to process the hardwood, for a fuel that is only has a fractionally higher calorific value. 

I do get that. In my limited time processing firewood the soft was by far easier and quicker to process than the hard. But is the calorific value determined by its weight? Ie, the softwood calorific value is slightly lower than hard per KG. Then if folk are buying logs by a volume and not weight then they will be getting significantly less calorific value but will be told they are getting slightly under Hardwood, and thats not true. 

 

4 minutes ago, Big J said:

Anyway, give us a few years and softwood/hardwood will almost be a moot point.

Why would that be? 

 

4 minutes ago, Big J said:

We're planting 75 acres of new eucalyptus woodland in May, and it's in a class of it's own.

So I hear, Id like to try some to see what its like.  

[The avantgardener]

The type of wood people burn generally depends on what grows in that particular area. High altitude/low temperature areas generally don’t grow much in the way of broadleaf so they will be burning softwood. Norway’s forests are made up of around 75% Birch, which is why it is the most widely used, in most firewood calorific value charts Birch sits right between two softwoods, Pine and Douglas Fir.

[Khriss]

Scandinavian countries seem to be dryer in winter, well its snow only - wood seems to grow with tighter grain so possibly makes it better than our soggy pine and spruce . K

[Turkey]

I get from 25% down to 18% in tunnels in 4 months during the  spring /summer but much longer in the autumn / winter when there is so much humidity in the air 

 

 

[Bolt]

29 minutes ago, Big J said:

 

Drax in Kent sucks up timber from as far as West Wales and Cornwall.

 

 

I thought Drax in Kent suckled up gas.

 

 

[Bolt]

3 minutes ago, Big J said:

They run the Biomass plant at Sandwich in Kent. Otherwise known as Kent Renewable Energy. 

 

Not renewable at all though. They import chip from (amongst other places) New Zealand (eucalyptus).

Cool.  Didn't know that one was part of the Drax empire.

[trigger_andy]

42 minutes ago, Big J said:

 

It was the 20kw stove from The Champion Stove Company. A Jotul copy.

Jøtul themselves seem to recommend Hardwoods, I have no idea what a copy of theirs would recommend though; 

 

Trust in Hardwoods

Different woods burn in different ways and hardwoods have proven to be among the best sources of heat for any wood burning stove. Hardwoods provide a dense wood structure when properly seasoned, and burn for much longer than the loose structure of soft woods such as pine and spruce. Oak and Elm are great Hardwoods, but can be difficult to burn within the unit as their density structure is sometimes too tight to burn. Some of the best choices include; Crab Apple, Hornbeam, Ash, Beech, and Hawthorn. These woods have proven over time to burn the best without too tight of an interior structure.

 

Some new wood stove owners attempt to burn pine as the wood is cheap, but Pine should always be avoided as the wood builds up harmful deposits within the flue. Overtime, the use has been known to cause fires. The wood is ideal for outdoor fires only as there is no risk of the harmful buildup in the great outdoors.

 

46 minutes ago, Big J said:

The slightly lower calorific value of softwood is more than offset by the fact that it takes only a fraction of the time to process, dries more quickly and is more readily available. Some of that cost saving can be passed onto the customer.

Everything you just mentioned only benefits the supplier and not the end user. With Softwood fractionally cheaper than Hardwood it makes no sense to buy softwood. Say you sell a Dumpy Bag of Softwood at a weight of 200kg, and the same Dumpy Bag of Hardwood at 350kg,  you're getting significantly less calorific value for a few quid cheaper. Where sellers to sell by weight alone only then does the calorific value really come into play. 

 

50 minutes ago, Big J said:

There is going to be a massive shortage of fuel wood in the coming decade. The Commission stopped planting large amounts of new woodland from the start of the 90s and many of the restocks after about 2000 (after softwood clearfells) were native broadleaf. Given that squirrels have knobbled most of these, and ash dieback is buggering the rest, there is a large gap in supply coming up and given that the (very hungry) RHI accreditted boilers on higher tariffs still have up to 17 years left, they will be able to pay more for timber than any firewood producer. Drax in Kent sucks up timber from as far as West Wales and Cornwall. The eucalyptus is the only way to plug the gap due to it's staggering growth rate.

Ah I see.  Interesting info, cheers.  

[Stubby]

2 minutes ago, trigger_andy said:

 

 

Trust in Hardwoods

Different woods burn in different ways and hardwoods have proven to be among the best sources of heat for any wood burning stove. Hardwoods provide a dense wood structure when properly seasoned, and burn for much longer than the loose structure of soft woods such as pine and spruce. Oak and Elm are great Hardw

 

Some new wood stove owners attempt to burn pine as the wood is cheap, but Pine should always be avoided as the wood builds up harmful deposits within the flue. Overtime, the use has been known to cause fires. The wood is ideal for outdoor fires only as there is no risk of the harmful buildup in the great outdoors.

 

 

This I feel is miss information . Soft woods do not cause the problems mentioned if seasoned properly .  All wood hard or soft will tar up the flue if burnt wet . 

 

[trigger_andy]

44 minutes ago, The avantgardener said:

The type of wood people burn generally depends on what grows in that particular area. High altitude/low temperature areas generally don’t grow much in the way of broadleaf so they will be burning softwood. Norway’s forests are made up of around 75% Birch, which is why it is the most widely used, in most firewood calorific value charts Birch sits right between two softwoods, Pine and Douglas Fir.

But they still are not interested in burning Softwood. I know a couple of sellers over there (Small Scale) and they simply cant shift it. People have been ingrained to think Birch is the way forward hence why they seem to import huge quantities for all the stoves almist every home seems to have there. They dont sell anything other that Birch in almost all the outlets I used. But when they are importing so much Birch you'd think they'd also import other hardwoods, but they dont. Anyway, the point being is they, like us in the UK are conditioned not to burn Softwood, for whatever reason.