Muddy42

Plus this on the Hetas website: Installation of second hand appliances after Ecodesign WWW.HETAS.CO.UK This article is a reproduction from HETAS Technical Bulletin #22. Click here to access the Bulletin in the Technical Area of the HETAS website (password There is a lot of negative posts here about pre-ecodesign stoves. Maybe they are stove installers, trying to sell new 'safe' stoves, just maybe??. The idea that thousands of stoves instantly became dangerous on the 1st of January 2022 as a result of a new regulation is frankly ridiculous. Talk to your installer and home insurance, if they aren't happy with the installation that will be the clincher. Someone also mentioned a warranty, personally I think the likelihood that I would ever claim is pretty low. The way I see it a stove is a metal box with a bunch of easy-to-replace wear parts (glass, rope, bricks). Even then the manufacturer could always claim I had burned the wrong wood or too hot. Some of my wood is certified but some is DIY, so hard to prove this.

Other things I've learned: - Leave the lids off when not in use to prevent flask going musty - Warm everything up with boiling water first. This makes even poor quality cheap flasks stay hot. - Have dedicated separate tea and soup/Bovril flasks - keep milk separate from tea until ready to drink. Sounds naff, but I was given a 200ml flask that is ideal for storing the milk.

I use a sterlilizer called Milton, designed for cleaning baby bottles! It removes stains and smells a treat. failing that weak bleach, as long as you rinse it well afterwards. If you are obsessive about tea like me, you can even soak and rinse it out with tea (using a second hand tea bag) to restore the tea flavour. and stanley flasks are the best!

Thanks.

For me it depends. If the logs are easy to split, I will split them where they are - on the ground, logs on their side, in a loose pile, whatever. This reduces double handling. Logs are easier to split when green, without knots or small. I will use a narrower axe. Very quick and hell of a workout. If the logs are medium hard, I will use a block and a maul. If the logs are very tough I will use a sledge hammer and wedges. If there are lots of them (OK double figures) I will block them up with a chainsaw. This can work well when combined with the wedges to finish off the cut. I don't have a mechanical splitter at the moment, last one broke, but its good for large volumes too.

Arbtalk Iphone app not working Dear @admin I downloaded the Arbtalk app on itunes a while back: https://apps.apple.com/gb/app/arbtalk/id596340923 It used to work fine, but now just says "no topics". I have tried re-installing etc. Can you provide any advice? Is there some other host app that works better. Thanks

Great, that's good to hear!

Sorry to be an @rse, but I always understood that dogs are really for felling big trees, when cross-cutting , the weight of the saw and sharp chain should do the work. Lots of people remove the dogs completely. I get it though, you may want some metal there to protect the saw/muffler etc.

The cynical side in me would say surely its quite hard to scientifically prove what and when has caused the fuel line damage in a 20 year old saw that has had hundreds or tanks through it, multiple owners and hours of work and abuse? Yes, you can prove that ethanol damages rubber now, but also rubber, gaskets and plastic can degrade over time, or the saw overheated or something else caused the damage. Anyway, personally I still think it is worth switching old saws to Alkaylate now. If your fuel system has damage or letting in air you should get that sorted anyway to avoid lean mix etc. Luckily my two 20 year old saws seem OK having switched to Alkayalte.

Thanks all. I will give a shorter bar a go, this is definitely just for occasional use. I will stick with .404 chain and sprocket, I am trying to reduce the number of chain permutations (pitch, files, sprockets) rather than increase them!

Cheers, how do you find using a 120cc 10kg saw for crosscutting?

I currently have two working saws: 1) Stihl 028 Wood Boss, 47cc with a 16 inch bar. 2) Stihl 088, with a 36 inch bar or 48 inch bar. [Note incompatible bar mounts] I love the 088, its a beast which is amazing in the alaksan mill. In terms of the saw work I do, it is mostly cleaning up windblow. I really like the 028 for small windblow, it runs fine and I can use it all day. The 028 is fine for any felling I do. But... there is the odd occasion where I am logging up big trees and I need something else, a bar length in the 21/25 inch range to deal with a big trunk. I have used the 088 and 36 inch bar before but I do find that length of bar too long and unwieldy when its not buried in wood (and frankly a bit scary!). - I don't want to buy a longer bar for the small saw, I hate small saws with long bars. - Does anyone use an 088 with a shorter 21/25inch bar? I can get an Oregon bar and 404 chain for £100 on ebay. Am I mad for considering, would it still be unwieldy? - If so, I guess I would consider getting a used MS460 for a few hundred quid. Any advice appreciated

Agreed, someone once told me you cant have to much chain oil. I suppose this makes sense when you think of all the stress and heat endured by the bar and chain.

I do find saws will make more oil mess when run without cutting wood (for example when tuning) Does the saw make a mess when cutting wood, bar buried to the tip?

Nice one. I find my eco mill benefited from some comfort refinements. I have used pipe insulation on the long handle. i’ve actually removed the upright handle because I didn’t use it as much. Ive also added a few jubilee clips to keep the long handle in position, it kept moving with the supplied screws. Milled some oak last weekend.

I have never had one myself but I have been at two chimney fires in other properties. Both owners didn’t sweep at all and burn’t unseasoned logs that they thought were dry by being in a shed for three months. It may not be a popular view with the stove installers (keen to sell the newest, safest, cleanest reg compliant new model, just maybe?) but I still believe you can burn wood safety in any setup (open fire, old stove, new stove) with good chimney hygiene, dry logs and a bit of care and common sense.

First off, I burn very dry logs (seasoned outside for 2 years and them stacked in the early summer in a side-less shed). I test them with a moisture meter. I agree with you about the benefits of this. The best safety initiative the government could implement would be to issue each new stove owner with a moisture meter. I am aware that blocking the holes could cause warranty or insurance issues. As I said I will burn it for a while before doing this as a last resort. As to the implication and creosote and chimney fires, I disagree based on my past experience. The aim of ecodesign is improving air quality in cities (I live in the sticks). Careful control of air does not necessarily lead to creosote and chimney fires. Just because you can clamp a stove down, doesn't mean you have to. I have used a few Clearview and Charnwood stoves for over 20 years now. I don't clamp them down for long periods or 'keep them in' overnight, just burn when needed. I clean the chimneys (one of them has had a camera down it) and honestly I have seen more ash in an ashtray, certainly no creosote. The open fires are a different matter, when burning the same dry wood, they can need cleaning twice a year and I have to treat the crerosote. My beef with ecodesign (and compulsory minimum air supply) is that it could take away control and ability to cool the stove down quickly. There could be perfectly good reasons for wanting to clamp a stove down for a short period (e.g. if the stove gets too hot, someone puts too much wood on, or there is a chimney fire).

I have just unwrapped a new Esse 1. The ecodesign is achieved via air intake rather than a cat etc. I also live in the sticks and would rather be fully in control of the stove's air intake. Please note it is more air control I am after, I am not aiming to run it closed down with the associated soot and dirt, I just want the ability to close it down, should I choose. The ecodesign features appear in two forms: 1. A hex grub screw in the travel of the primary air intake to keep it cracked open. That will be removed shortly after the installer leaves the house. 2. Two holes in the back of the stove. The nice people at Esse told me about these. As these holes are round I am sure a small section of threaded steel rod could fit. I think I will see how it runs first, in case the rod binds/expands or gets stuck. Massive disclaimer: Esse did not recommend this nor I am I. Any modifications to your stove are done at your own risk.

It depends on how much you like stoking your stove every 30 mins? Personally I am fine with chasing cleanliness and efficiency by other means, reburn, flue design, catalytic convertors or whatever. But restricting a stove’s air intake so it is always a little open just seems like a blunt approach to me. What happens if you live in an old house, tall chimneys, leaky windows and amazing draft? If you cant shut the stove down what can you do if it gets too hot or someone else puts too much wood on? What happens if you have a chimney fire? Rather like tuning carburettors, I’d far rather be in control of the air mix than at the mercy of someone else’s factory setting, thank you very much!

Also what about engine size? Could you not have an efficiency compliant 12kw stove and an older non-compliant 4kw stove. Surely the former produces more total emissions?

Thanks I will check them out. Quite a few are described as "ecodesign ready." I need to check what that means, hopefully I interpret this as "ready" for a cat or air stop mechanism, that can be removed. I will check before buying.

Very interesting. I am looking for a new or used stove, but it must be small or sub 5kw, because its for a small room. Any recommendations? Also I am in a remote area and definitely not smoke controlled. I would like a stove where the ecodesign feature can be disabled, allowing slow burning and shut down. I appreciate what the rules are trying to do but I would prefer to be in control of the air supply to my fire, thank you very much.

These are both relatively common saws. There will be masses of them offered on ebay on facebook marketplace at anyone time. This might help you with asking prices if not value. As said before, the second hand prices offered for these disposable saws amazes me. Why pay £150 on a second hand gamble when you can buy new for a few quid more? I feel differently about larger professional saws. I find them easier to fix and longer lasting.

I wonder which pre-mix fuel brand decided to be different? You raise a potentially valid excuse, stihl and husky could say they were making their equipment compatible with existing thread nozzles on combi cans etc. didnt’t a previous post say that Aspen is compatible with Husky pre-mix fuel nozzles. So Stihl is the odd one out. This lack of compatability could have existed for a very long time.

I can now answer my own question. The nozzle for Stihl Motomix cans is larger than Aspen. This is frustrating, I will have to use a funnel again.