drinksloe

Mibbee a UK/USA thing but I wouldn't be using a Humboldt cut on a tree like that. ( Occasionally use them when u want the tree to snap off hinge, I use them for felling to skylines or on steep bankings where I don't want to need to go back and sever the hinge, hence why used when climbing ) If go with the standard face/gub cut, more likely for hinge to hold which is exactly wot u want n the circumstances. If u want butt to slide off u can put a snipe in gub towards the edge off the tree but u still need the horizontal face too. ( angled cut on the horizontal) But not sure why u would want it sliding off anyway and if felling downhill hinge will close and snap anyway almost which ever cut u use. I'd far rather hinge held as long as possible to direct it where I wanted it, I also wouldn't put any sap wood cuts in to protect the timber from ripping. Forestry cutters will knock trees like that over, or slightly smaller all the time multiple times a day ( most forestry cutters Willbe felling 3-4ft butts and 100-120ft trees as there bread and butter oversized tree usually with far more lean and wieght on 1 side) From photos doesn't look to complicated a fell to an experienced cutter looks to be plenty of room and generally soft woods hold a good hinge ( althou not all do Grandis Fir can be a brittle hinge) This is where experience comes in knowing ur tree species and likely hood of any butt rot or other defects ( knots won't make any difference, atleast in species i usually fell) seen hairy Norway's with paps/knots the size of ur leg never had any problems with knots. A back leaner won't barbers chair anyway I'd use a 20t bottle jack plus wedges, if I was worried about side lean might put a guy rope on to counter it ( done that with an ugly heavily leaning wieghted larch yest, over a field and council road). Tirfor as a guy and 20t jack in it But like many things experienced boys make it look easy BUT trees that size if they go wrong will go wrong big style and very little u can do to stop them once the cuts are in even if u realise u've screwed up. It's not rocket science but also not the sort of job for an amatuer. Get it wrong it could very well kill u or crush ur house

I've thought this before, felling is risky mostly not because the forces are unpredictable but because the material properties are unpredictable. It is weights and levers. Like everything every tree is different and even will depend on weather conditions as well at exact time of felling. I'd far rather fell a tree than climb it, as I feel more control over it, but I'm a rubbish climber and was only average 20yrs ago when I done a bit I wouldn't even think about jacking or even wedging any hard wood with much of a lean on it. I think in soft woods ( esp SS or NS u can get away with murder, not just as much in larch, douglaus and Grandis is quite brittle for a soft wood) hinge is far more predictable, most off the time. As the timber is generally still in its prime and generally stronger and more flexible anyway. In ARB ur generally dealing with mature, over aged or diseased/damaged if ur felling them. Also the numbers of trees ur knocking over compared to ARB boys. Be doing 10s of big stuff if snedding/crosscutting a day and more if just felling As well as in most places even if it goes wrong chances are not going to be a lot off major damage, a broken stock fence etc. On bigger stuff 3ft+ butts I think ur jack is far enough away from the hinge not to be lifting the hinge. I have had problems on smaller larch around the 20ish inch butts, heavily leaning and wieghted ( possibly leaning back10 Deg and some limbs could be 4 or 5m into field) and had to be felled directly against wieght as over a gully and was struggling for hieght for the harvester to reach the tips. And into the prevailing wind, althou got lucky a few days with unusual N winds. Rightly or wrongly I was cutting my pocket above the back cut which made things worse. But was a good bit quickier. Thought it made it a tidier job with low stumps and all going to chip anyway and didn't want to leave all the small logs lying where I recut stumps. On the more heavily leaning smaller stuff it was lifting the hinges u had to watch and wedge as well, but would really struggle to wedge them alone. Possibly the ideal test for the hydraulic wedge, not too big but enough wieght to make wedging hard work, plus the ammount of trees needing knocked over ( about 400m, so guessing 200ish edge trees) But trees that size are just a pain u havenae got the room to do much and even knocking wedges in at angles or parrellel to hinge as u'll end up against it otherwise, but snookers u for putting a bigger wedge in. Bloody hate small back leaners

Done a few like that right behind my own house, minus the machines. Just a solo effort on tirfor and another winch. Was laying them along the house within 4m or so, surrounded by other targets too. No matter how often u've done it before still squeaky bum time on a few. Think I gave myself false confidence with that 1, had doubts 1st thing but rest went over so easily despite gusting wind, but when gusting wind got stronger and more constant I should never have tried to put it where I did. Every day's a school day, and no one was hurt To me I'm sure they will be brilliant for 70% of trees in forestry work but u still need a jack to do the other 15% and the last 5 prob need a hurricane in right direction or a real winch. Yes a jacks heavy and takes time but if I've walked 1 mile into a wood I should be able to handle most trees I need to do.

To be fair almost entirely in soft woods, with hard woods I would be wanting a winch on them esp after a certain size as I never think many hard wood hinges can be trusted. Seen the same happen with sycamore even with a tirfor on when tree starts to go and gravity takes over, just can't pump tirfor fast enough, I often put 2 ropes/winches on some hard woods now. And wouldn't even go near with a jack. And in honesty had a SS go sideways with me the other day, not massive massive, prob just under 4ft butt and not massively tall but corner so 2 bad leans on ( first track and green ride) and a lot of heavy branches Althou the smaller 35t tigercat said his machine would not look at moving it even on the deck, bigger tigercat driver was covering an another machine, so was a decent sized stick. Left it to last to see how the others went of similar size but only the 1 lean, went over a doodle. Even thou wind was against me. After I gubbed tree wind really picked up, Was a struggle jacking and wedging hard but eventually got back cut opened up 4+" and jack going really well thought I had it and hinge snapped on me. Luckily I got it far enough it only went over the ride and not the track. Should off put it there in 1st place and saved a bit of work and worry or put my tirfor on it just to take wind pressure off. Hindsight

How rough a tree will it push over thou?? I currently work with a 20t bottle ( and got a proper 30T Treeman's on order which was not cheap but should last a long time) and had it struggling a few times. But seen me at full extension and tree still sitting balanced as so much wieght on the wrong side. From wot I was told there only good for medium sized trees with not too much back lean/wieght on them. So u still need something bigger Incan for the real hairy outside monsters. But can see it saving a lot of time not cutting the pocket at back and getting the stumps that bit lower

Only saves u walking to the other side off a tree if using a bar big enough ( like u tend to see on American clips/TV) but most in UK forestry don't run about with silly long bars. I'm sure in life of the saw the time saved not walking round the tree, will be tiny compared to the time lost using a big bar to sned the tree when on the deck. Possibly more so with the extra wieght and bulk of the wrap handle. And if ur using the extra wrap around bit does that not mean the whole saw body and handle is below the cut on the ground??

Try searching the history on here I think there has been threads on it before. Or try googling it. I'll be honest not the easiest thing to explain, even some of the videos of it aren't that clear. Also I think some folk call it that but then do something different. And I can never make out just how much the tree was leaning in the 1st place.

I've always meant to have a wee play like that stubby and will do sometime. But when ever u get trees u can fell any direction I usually take the easy option and just fell the way they want to go/ or with wind. Usually under pressure to get more down so never make the time to have a play. But I will sometime In forestry u do have to wedge/jack/winch a lot off trees against wieght, if the Dutchman was so successful and safe everyone would be using them quite often. I take it ur not that impressed with the cut then stubby???

I'll be honest I've never had the courage to try a proper Dutchman so I'm probably not the best person to describe it. Had plenty opportunities in timber that would work but bottle it as always a fence to damage or it would get hung up on other trees if went wrong I just either wedge or nowadays jack them over atleast u know that way u have full control and it shouldn't go wrong. Jacking is the way forward if u can't get a skidder/winch in, can lift over some big ugly leaning trees, but again more with softwoods as u need hinge to hold Try googling them, a few different types Sort of banned in a lot of USA states, And i dare say most foresters here would kick u off site for using them too. I think work well when work but when they don't it just all goes proper Pete tong Really a quite advanced cut that u will have to judge the situation well beforehand. A,mount of lean/wieght tree species etc. Don't imagine it would work in dead trees/oaks.

I think it used to be called a pie cut. Probably other names too A Dutchman u sever or severely weaken the hinge on 1 side U'd sever the pointy side of triangle. Really any off these cuts only truely work when u expect 1 side off the hinge to hold, esp when under real tension, so more in certain softwoods and possibly even certain times of year, when sap in stem. Definately not cuts to try in dead trees or some/many hardwoods or any tree with targets nearby.

With hard woods i generally always expect hinges to snap to some degree, they don't hold anything like most soft woods esp with wieght or lean on it. Oak are better than most even dead, I'd rather fell a dead oak than a live sycamore at times. Even with a winch esp a hand winch/tirfor I had a few near 1s with sycmore even with a tirfor on them. I find they often go exactly how u want them to when u winch but when gravity takes over the hinge often snaps and if any side wieght it will go off at a tangent to felling direction. Different with a tractor winch it can keep the tension on but with a tirfor u just can't keep pump tirfor fast enough. Now I usually put a 2nd hand winch on to take the side wieght off and main winch roughly in direction of fall. If only using the 1 winch it can't be straight in direction of fall needs to take some of side pressure as well Edit I see open Spaceman mentioned this on the last page to but better described. I often work alone in the wood around my house with a lot off sycamore so tend to work with a snatch bock out in front and attach my tirfor to a tree either to the side or behind the tree I am cutting. It does double the power but it also makes it harder to keep up when it starts to go. The reason I do it as it means I can work the winch and safely go back to the tree I'm cutting to fine tune hinge, winch a bit cut a bit and vice versa, . On smaller trees seen me grab rope and just run with it sometimes enough to just keep it going where u want as winch has done the hard work already. Dunno how many trees u have to fell, but u might be worth felling some of the easy ones just to get a feel for it. If there going to blow down anyway. Trees go wrong if cut enough, but ur better to make mistakes out where it doesn't matter, if ur on a safety critical tree and it goes wrong u have a problem.

It sounds like ur doing ok as it is. To be fair dead oak tends to hold its strength and branches more than other dead trees, but not done masses of it. In ur 1st post i think u talked about those back protector things, if it's wot I'm thinking about, only seen photos, looks like a space rocket strapped to ur back. U look a right tool wearing it but worse if a branch hits them it would probably break ur back anyway. Even with a winch If possible I would be trying to fell them with lean as much as possible, even if it means hitting a fence. Fences are easy fixes esp if u stripped it n advance before u dropped tree on it. Also I think I would probably bore from both sides 1st and leave a strap at back, generally back will be safer and u can be looking up a bit more or standing further away from the tree when just severing a strap when not being precise around hinges. I tend to do the same when cutting a a machine assisting, ur just slightly more aware of wot's going on. But just got to wiegh up every tree as u do anyway but just look a bit harder. Ur ratchet strap is a good idea, by rights if no middle shouldnae really barbers chair but could still go early if ur cutting from 1 side round back to other. But for the little time it takes to put on, I'd far rather have it on and not need it than the other way.

Wot's the point benefit in wrap handles??? Do they not get in the way when putting low gubs in or doing back cut? I think someone told me it was cos in USA there not allowed/meant to use a pushing chain so could always use a pulling chain.

A lot might depend on tree species. In most trees most of strength is in the sap wood round edges rather than the heart wood. With big soft woods esp if over aged ( tends to be more butt rot in over aged stands) I'm always careful about taking toes/buttress roots off near where I want hinge to be. They can add a lot of strength f in right place. Otherwise get a rope/winch on it, learn to use a throw line to get rope up into tree, makes life easier. But every tree is different anyway and needs to be assessed but even more so if faults or rotten. And keep ur head on a swivel watching for any falling limbs. Not really for beginners. There is a clip online of a tree just imploding with a cutter below it, he doesn't know which way to run. Bloody scary stuff as it looks like he knew wot he was doing, a fair stick as well.

I think most electric companies work a 5 year rolling cycle, and have to check the whole system and it it back every 5 years. Really u might be as well ripping them out and planting some fruit bushes or making it into a garden/veg garden. The contracts for power lines is always changing too so no guarantee all the contractors would actually coppice the tree some might cut stem at base to save doing it next time. Any native tree that handles coppicing will have more ecological benefits than sycamore or turn it into a wild flower/butterfly strip?

Dunno if u can get the electric start on that size? I think I have a 450? and has electric start. Bloody brilliant and heaps of power More so if ur likely to meet folk for a blether when ur out blowing leafs about. Can turn it off for a blether and turn it back on again without taking it off ur back. If ur in the middle of no where mibbee doesnae matter

Only guessing but could 1 be for hard wood and soft wood? On the old 32 u had different sub sections for breaking hard wood crowns down I think it's because some of the new units they dreamed up were already parts of other courses so had to split the old coarse. When the old coarses made sense as they were My last ticket/assesment was assisted fell, saved doing a fisa refresher, but wot a waste of time, everything used to be covered in both small and med trees. Nothing new. I imagine dangerous trees will be the same

Aye so it looks like uve built the pallets round ur high splitting log and it fits semi snuggly in. Mibbee easier adding it on side and bodge in with ply till u experiment wot suits u best I once screwed some rails on to my high splitting log and cut some ply to fit over it, more to hold my tyre in place than pile logs on Personally I have never really got on that well double stacking logs. Usually I found the 2nd 1 would topple over when u hit the top 1 and esp so if ur cross cutting is squint. But everyone will have there own way there happy with.

A lot might depend on ur location, wot work is available and if a few big companies have the work sown up. No point in competeing with them if u can help it, better to find a niche if u can Gdhs suggestions are a good shout. In Scotland crying out for ground prep machines, mounding and ploughing, dunno how it is elsewhere.. But bloody boring work But with all these targets for new forestry it must be needed. If u get into proper forestry work many have there machines forestry guarded, stronger belly plates, raised, cab protection esp if using a tree sheer u really should have FOPS, possibly marguard the window if using a mulcher I think ticket wise it gets really confusing with ur citb and noprs? for ur standard building site work but u then need FMOC tickets for forestry It might be worth u switching jobs and getting a FT job with a digger company doing the this type of work., U'll learn wot u like and also how long jobs take, u could easy get into trouble pricing jobs when u don't have the experience, no good working for nowt.

I think when they changed all the tickets/numbers just below and above 380? dia now They also done away with multiple windblow, althou to be fair most forestry companies have banned cutting windblow by hand anyway. Billhook even on those bids never seen them boring the gub the way were speaking about here. Have u tried looking at Nptc med/large tree handouts, I'm sure they used to be online. Used to be decent handouts with diagrams Or Google letterbox felling cuts or something think that's the right name for it Dunno if u can even do it with a Humboldt cut?? Not a fan of Humboldt and struggle with them, but if u bored into the face the way u do with a normal face cut and ur back cut is the top side of it, the 2 cuts could easy be 4-6" if not more apart. Dunno if that would matter? But wouldn't help if wedging or even jacking. U wouldn't want to wedge over a tree with a split level cut if there was 6" difference

I've never met or heard of anyone running a 13" bar on a 70cc saw. In fact I'm 1 of the few I know that even works with a 15" usually for brashing only. Even for brashing most use 18" on a 50 or 60cc saw, know a few on the narrow 325/1.3mm chain. I quite like the narrow chain esp on sub 60cc saws. Really an 18-20" bar should cover u for 90% off forestry work. I use 13" bars for scrubby hardwood stuff but a 13" bar would struggle to fell anything really forestry wise

Aye there reputation is terrible for it. Althou I've never used 1 meant to have some power too,but they are an 80cc saw Due a new 70cc saw shortly. Was thinking about going for 1 but thought thought off carrying 2 combi cans put me right off. Thinking a 462 instead.

Not my biggest trees, but decent enough sticks. ( quite rare for me to take phone out van, rarely gets a signal anyway) In fact really just wee bit over average sized OS, depending on spec but OS usually starts about 80cm ish and most harvesters running 70-80cm bars. So bulk of work is felling trees 3ft ish + and most hand cutters i know tend to run 20 bars for all but very biggest stuff and mange fine

Aye I got that witterings but they will never be strong enough and too much give in them to chop off for very long I think u have misunderstood me, I'd cut a hole/corner off ur 'pallet table/worktop' and fit a chopping block into that hole so u have 1 solid block/log to the ground to chop off, so nice and solid with no give but still have ur pallet table around it for piling logs on. If that makes sense

The difference with ARB u will likely have the luxury of a 2nd saw to sned/breakdown crown, and most likely easy access. In forestry will need to use that saw all day and likely carry it there and back and the fuel for it ( as many finding out with the 500i) Last time I took a 2nd saw up the wood bloody harvester dropped a tree over it. To be honest aspen sounds like ur man hadnae a clue, really should be cutting stumps the same hieght anyway wether big or small bar. Althou if u need to take a load off toes off it will take time, but ud prob need to trim the toes for the sawmill anyway. Seen me caught out more if im brashing with a 15" and u knock an O/S tree over as ur passing on way out, plus u usually won't have the right gear with u either. Seen me cutting my own wedges and using a big branch as a sledge and a lot off swearing.