Top Handles and proof of training.

[peatff]

Lightweight domestic saws obviously tempt stupid people to use them single handed too.

 

I have seen a domestic user with no experience of chainsaws hacking a conifer with an Efco MT 3500 using it single handed above head height off a ladder (despite him being scared of heights so not confident on the ladder either) with his PPE left in the shed as he said "it's only a couple of branches so not worth putting it on".

 

In that instance I intervened much to the relief of his wife who was footing the ladder mobile phone in hand ready to call an ambulance.

 

I remember an incident reported nationally with a similar scenario where the wife was holding the ladder and was killed when the saw hit her after her husband fell.

[Rich Rule]

I remember that. It was in Eltham about 2 miles from my house.

 

The amount of redicoulous call out we had after that for things like a 3 foot high holly bush etc.

 

Very sad news for the gentleman and lady involved. Very good for business.

 

It is a terrible shame that it takes someone death for people to realise that an accident with a saw could have such serious consequences.

 

On another note, I can't wait till someone comes out with a top handle 660.

[Coletti]

You can use it with one hand, freeing the other hand up for amputation.

 

I don't think it's just this that's the issue. A top handle is also less controllable in the event of kickback even with 2 hands on the saw which to the inexperienced user is just as dangerous as 1 handing in my opinion. I'm all for having to produce proof of training before purchase

[treequip]

I don't believe that this particular threat is coming from the HSE, but from the Market Surveillance Authorities, whoever they may be.

The threat can only come from the HSE because they are the only ones with any powers.

 

Also, I would not write the threat off as 'hollow', the ban has been made in some countries already.

That's not in the UK though is it? There wasn't the political will to instigate this last time it was mooted, and that's when the government had money to spend, in this day and age they even have to make you pay for your own punishment (fee for intervention)

Don't underestimate what a ban would require to make it work. A ban would need legislation, a statutory instrument, debate in parliament. A ban would need a tariff of penalties and enforcement.

Now I don't see the HSE raiding work sites hunting down toppers and that's what it would take. Then consider the rewards a ban would bring the HSE, unless you are killing and maiming a significant number of people in a commercial environment the HSE aren't going to act.

 

The biggest problem lies with the dealers however. Most dealers toe the line, but there are also a few who think the rules do not apply to them, or are oblivious to the rules anyway (They do not all read the trade press

Its not about reading trade press, that's way too vague, the restriction on sales was as a result of a MOU between the HSE and manufacturers so its down to the manufacturers to ensure the dealers behave. Its been in place a while now and some newer distributors particularly from smaller manufacturers may not even know it exists

[dan494]

I went into a Vauxhall dealer last year and bought a car without showing my driving licence. I've never rode a motorbike in my life and have no licence to do so but pretty sure I could go and order one without being questioned.

Both of these are way more dangerous than a 35cc chainsaw??

If someone wants to buy a chainsaw and do whatever with it that's down to them I say. Most people will use common sense because not doing so results in a chainsaw in the face or leg

 

(Appreciate its illegal to drive without a license but am referring to dealer responsibility)

Edited November 2, 2015 by dan494

[eggsarascal]

Is this thread more about sales than safety?

 

Is it that some dealers get the hump because some of the 'big boys' are distance selling in huge quantities, so therefore the big dealers can knock out saws a lot cheaper than the smaller dealers. Just asking loike.

[skyhuck]

Is this thread more about sales than safety?

 

Is it that some dealers get the hump because some of the 'big boys' are distance selling in huge quantities, so therefore the big dealers can knock out saws a lot cheaper than the smaller dealers. Just asking loike.

 

I was thinking the same after the OP's latest post

[skyhuck]

I don't think it's just this that's the issue. A top handle is also less controllable in the event of kickback even with 2 hands on the saw which to the inexperienced user is just as dangerous as 1 handing in my opinion. I'm all for having to produce proof of training before purchase

 

Which is why I made this post following my earlier one

Holding a saw from the top with only one hand cannot possible have the same control as holding a saw with both hands, where one of the handles is well back giving mechanical advantage.

 

.

[GardenKit]

so its down to the manufacturers to ensure the dealers behave. Its been in place a while now and some newer distributors particularly from smaller manufacturers may not even know it exists

 

Hence the wording of the AEA press release in my OP

The AEA (Agricultural Engineers Association) recently repeated its advice to manufacturers and distributors of chainsaws asking them to remind their dealers that top handle saws must only be supplied to bona-fide tree surgeons or operators trained (with proof of training) in their use.

[GardenKit]

Is this thread more about sales than safety?

 

Is it that some dealers get the hump because some of the 'big boys' are distance selling in huge quantities, so therefore the big dealers can knock out saws a lot cheaper than the smaller dealers. Just asking loike.

 

Come on Eggs, read the first post properly, and stop looking for a conspiracy theory:big grin:

 

No mention of any complaints from dealers. Just a reminder to dealers.

 

I simply posted it because I thought it may be of interest and let members know where the issue of providing proof of training came from in the first place.