Post and rail - to concrete or not?

[Timbur]

It's going in clay/chalk soil.

Never felt the need to concrete before, just put back in what came out with a bit of compacting with a rammer.

Opinions?

 

for info it's a resi post and rail fence with weld mesh on one side. No animals to contain, just small kids. Pretty rather than functional.

[Matthew Storrs]

I don't concrete post and rail myself, its more time, expense, can cause the timber to rot quicker at the base plus its a pain in the backside if it ever needs removing or replacing.

Well consolidated back filled posts with 750mm in the ground and staggered rails will be good and strong enough. Even better is driven posts if you have a post rammer and a means to keep the posts square as they're being driven.

[Nick Connell]

I agree if you can knock them in with a basher that's the best bet.

 

Have found the ground sooo hard at the moment that if your digging posts in with out concrete its difficult to tamp the soil back in tight while its so dry.

 

 

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[doobin]

I agree if you can knock them in with a basher that's the best bet.

 

Have found the ground sooo hard at the moment that if your digging posts in with out concrete its difficult to tamp the soil back in tight while its so dry.

 

 

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It's the same story when it's wet too mate!

 

Sandy or chalk soil = no problem, just whack the spoil back in. Clay can be problematic. If it's wet it just won't consilidate and can also cause problems with shrinkage when it dries out and gets wet again. I had good results using crushed chalk as backfill on some fairly damp clay. Cheap, effective and can be removed easily in future.

[Goaty]

As Matt says concrete is a rot accelarator. Bash in or backfill. Only use concrete with concrete or metal posts. Many however do use concrete. But do they care about lifespan of their work.

[nepia]

It's going in clay/chalk soil.

Never felt the need to concrete before, just put back in what came out with a bit of compacting with a rammer.

Opinions?

 

for info it's a resi post and rail fence with weld mesh on one side. No animals to contain, just small kids. Pretty rather than functional.

 

 

On a large farm nearish you (Arundel) we used to do the above for strength fencing, gateposts etc: sleepers were dug in 3' and backfilled with what came out. Never used concrete; the work was always done in the rain!

So for cosmetic purposes it will be fine.

[GreenGui]

I did about 50 meters back in the spring, 1 meter clay based top soil. Bored to 750mm and back filled with a 0/20 gravel mix rammed/tamped, worked a treat.

 

As others have said with your soil description you should be able to just use the fill. Don't envy you doing it now though...

[Matthew Storrs]

Iv done plenty of post and rail back filled with peat as that's what came out. Surprising how strong it all was once the rails were on. Evenentually the soil settles anyway and firms up. Might be different if you had cattle scratching their asses on it but otherwise most soils will back fill OK.

Before I had a postrammer I used to back fill all my gateposts and hang a 12ft wooden gate on- and it still didn't move.

[nepia]

Might be different if you had cattle scratching their asses on it but otherwise most soils will back fill OK.

 

Ass-scratching cattle weren't the problem; it was the bloody tractor drivers that were the problem!

[woody paul]

Even driven gate post and post / rail come loss in clay, when back to a job I did a couple of years ago gate posts loose ramed a round them with tractor mounted thumper and a old stake tightened them out a treat.