Buying a woodland

[woodyguy]

Well said Countryboy. You enjoy your wood and wouldn't be without it.

But like me it is a lifestyle choice not an investment. You get firewood and put a lot of time, effort and money into the wood. So I'd encourage people to buy woods to enjoy them and sustain them for future generations. I see little evidence of people making substantial money from investing in small woods however.

[ArthurBottlesworth]

I think its equity and revenue again

Bugger all income (revenue) each year , but your capital (equity) is growing

So as long as you can live onyour income whats the problem?

 

Staying away from debt and posh garages seems the way forward to me ......

I'd rather have my woods than a range rover.....

[woodyguy]

Thanks Arthur, so I think we've established that income stream will not be enough to borrow money and service the loan. So its down to equity growth.

So do we have any examples of people on this fairly large site who can say "yes I bought an 8 acre wood in 1992 for £32k and sold it in 2001 for £48k and then bought a 12 acre wood in 2003 for £60k and sold it in 2013 for £125k". That's what I'd need to see before I believe that I'm going to retire rich (or pass on untold wealth to my children) from my small woodland.

[Welshwoodsman]

Thanks Arthur, so I think we've established that income stream will not be enough to borrow money and service the loan. So its down to equity growth.

 

So do we have any examples of people on this fairly large site who can say "yes I bought an 8 acre wood in 1992 for £32k and sold it in 2001 for £48k and then bought a 12 acre wood in 2003 for £60k and sold it in 2013 for £125k". That's what I'd need to see before I believe that I'm going to retire rich (or pass on untold wealth to my children) from my small woodland.

 

 

Back to my original post-

Its quite possible to make a lot of money on site value alone- but not if you pay far too much in the beginning. I paid 45k for 30 acres in a national park, and a unesco world heritage site- with a very idyllic canal along the bottom. I know there will be substantial financial gain in the land- but in relation to 4 acres or so for 45k i got a bargain! Small plots are very unlikely to be worth 10's of thousands more than purchase price. Although attractive, and i looked at everything they had jn wales and kent, your best bet is local estate agents, john clegg and Raymond Barker in builth wells.

[renewablejohn]

Do take professional advice re tax as HMRC have some very silly rules which can easily catch you out. We have woodland as part of our farm but have been caught out with the woodland grants as the grant planted land is no longer deemed as agricultural land and therefore could have implications on the IHT position on our farmhouse.

[spandit]

You can offset the value of standing timber in woodland for IHT purposes, though

 

http://www.voa.gov.uk/corporate/Publications/Manuals/InheritanceTaxManual/sections/j-section_10/iht-man-s10-pt1.html

[ArthurBottlesworth]

Do take professional advice re tax as HMRC have some very silly rules which can easily catch you out. We have woodland as part of our farm but have been caught out with the woodland grants as the grant planted land is no longer deemed as agricultural land and therefore could have implications on the IHT position on our farmhouse.

 

Please tell me more

How did this work?

[renewablejohn]

Please tell me more

How did this work?

 

As Spandit points out IHT allowable on woodlands but the small print is the exclusion if ancillary to agri land which our FWPS grant scheme is as it was to provide shelter belts. You would therefore think it would be eligible under Agri IHT rules but no HMRC insist the FWPS land has been taken out of agri production which effectively has reduced our IHT relief by 30%. Had we been told the grant would have this devastating effect we would not have bothered.

[campanula]

As an investment, I guess much depends on future use. Apart from growth in equity, I personally believe our little patch of wood is a priceless investment in many ways....but we are committed to using this space imaginatively rather than merely waiting for its value to appreciate. True, owning 5 acres of poplar is not going to make our fortunes as it stands.....but, we have space, a heartbreakingly beautiful location (along the Yare at entrance to the Broads) and we have (some) useful skills. We are essentially a family of gardeners, youngest is a metal worker interested in running a small forge, middle daughter works in play therapy and forest school type things while oldest is keen woodworker and bodger. We just want to hang out, grow woodland flowers (and maybe a small plant nursery), walk dogs and loaf in the horsebox......so the investment in our personal happiness has been a plus in every way. Moreover, even despite restrictive planning laws, I have every expectation that there will be a way to utilise this space to build a small, off-grid residence....but regardless, we have something which we can pass on to our grandchildren, add to the sum amount of beauty in the world, make a better wood and wildlife habitat and spend as much free time as we can idling in sylvan delight - what is there to quibble about? A priceless investment of £32,000 (and not through Woodlands.co either - try auctions and local estate agents).

[difflock]

My 40 odd acres of mixed age Conifer and Lodgepole, oldest plot about 40 years, youngest plot probably 25 years old.

I was offered (i) £10,000.00 for the lot

or

(ii) A tonne price at the Roadside, but I paid for all "roadmaking" to extract.

Now I may just be a trifle cynical, but I would deduce the road making contractor and the timber extractor would have a very close working relationship!

So I would realize very little.

And Prob in both extraction sceanarios, in Moss, would be left with a massive rutted wasteland.

So if/when I get a roadway in (and I am getting there year on year) I will employ a harvester to cut the timber directly.

After I establish a paying market.

BUT

More importantly I am deriving great pleasure from bringing on the naturally seeded (by Jay's?) Oak and the very Occosional wind seeded Beech.

By this I mean cutting away competing overshodowing tress and bushs.

By the time I die in 20 to 30 years I hope to have and to leave some REAL woodland for future generations to enjoy.

Marcus