public liability insurance

[MWArb]

Well I guess technically a bona fide subby is someone that comes out, prices for part or the whole job eg stump grinding as mentioned earlier and then carries out at their own expense but when I work for others eg climbing or grounding, I still class my self as a subby and not employed. This appears to be a rather foggy area haha. Suppose technically no one in the arb industry an manage without el due to not using a saw alone there for always having the need to employ someone else's services

 

 

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The question comes with how much or how little of the job you can quote for.. and when it seams you become integral to the original contract.. I was informed the same as you, not necessary under the conditions you described however I believe in siding with caution till I could prove either way.

[Mark Bolam]

That's how I see it Steve.

If I'm pricing it, I'm liable for all of it, and everyone working on it.

[Steve Bullman]

You guys who are questioning wether to purchase insurance or not are looking at the wrong insurance to omit if you are looking to cut corners. EL is a legal requirement, PL isn't, so if you're only going to take one then it should be EL. Most of the excuses that you plan to use for not having EL would quickly be taken apart in court.

[MWArb]

I think people are just over complicating this and looking for clever ways of getting our of it. Bottom line is if you're taking on your own work and using someone, just take out EL...its not going to bankrupt you and should be worked into your pricing anyway. If you dont want to do things properly then go and take an employed position IMO

 

Professionally I agree Steve and do have EL cover, I was just curious as people often talk of fine print being a stumbling block on insurance claims and having been told I didn't need it as coletti described I wondered at what exact points EL becomes a legal must and do people end up covered or not covered simply because of the relationship technicality.. sorry my head asks these questions and you guys are the best when it comes to nice friendly debate :thumbup:

At no point was I thinking of trading without it.

[Coletti]

Just taken this from another site and is quite clear in my opinion

 

Who do I need employers liability insurance for?

You need to take out insurance for all your employees. This is usually straightforward but if you have self-employed people working for you on a regular basis they may be covered too. Their tax status or job title is irrelevant. What matters is the real nature of the relationship you have with them and the degree of control you have over the work they do.

 

There are no definite rules, but the following should help you work out whether or not someone is an employee for the purpose of employers liability insurance:

 

You will need employers liability insurance if some or all of the following statements apply:

 

You deduct National Insurance and tax from the money you pay them

 

You have the right to control where, when and how they work

 

You supply most materials and equipment

 

You have right to the profits and suffer the losses your worker makes

 

You hire that person to do the job and the cannot send a substitute in their place

They are treated as other employees, eg they enjoy the same terms and conditions

 

You will not need employers liability insurance if some or all of the following statements apply:

 

You do not deduct tax or National Insurance (though this alone is not conclusive proof)

 

They do not work exclusively for you

 

They supply most of the equipment and materials they need to do for the job

 

They are clearly in business for personal benefit

 

They can employ a substitute when they are unable to do the work themselves

 

You normally don’t need to insure volunteers but you will need cover for students working unpaid, participants taking part in a youth or adult training programme or a school student on a work experience programme. If this applies to you, inform your insurance company and consider taking out insurance as they may be classed as employees.

 

You only need to insure domestic help such as gardeners and cleaners if they work exclusively for you. If they have more than one client you are probably exempt.

 

 

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[MWArb]

This was my point.. depending how you look at the relationship you could tick one or more of those on either side, would it not be easier make it a requirement regardless of these rules

[Ian C]

I think people are just over complicating this and looking for clever ways of getting our of it. Bottom line is if you're taking on your own work and using someone, just take out EL...its not going to bankrupt you and should be worked into your pricing anyway. If you dont want to do things properly then go and take an employed position IMO

 

Thats about the botyom line of it.

[felixthelogchopper]

That's how I see it Steve.

If I'm pricing it, I'm liable for all of it, and everyone working on it.

 

Pretty good rule of thumb there.

[Stevedavid43]

I too was looking for public liability insurance after looking on this link I phoned trust £316 all in well chuffed they were ver helpful and not pushy.

thanks for the link guys.

[dan494]

Is that with employers liability too?