Arborist are we skilled or semi skilled

[arbclimber]

tony unless you find peace in yourself you will never be content. Like it or not, the amount of money we take home at the end of the day, is the medal we recieve. it might be a plastic one for effort or gold for being good at what you do. you say you are not financially motivated, yet you are struggling at the moment. I am not a cowboy and i do adhere to h+s, i am serious about going AA aproved aswell, but only if its financially worth while, simples. i have always been a grafter, and usually the volume of work you get through equalls the amount of money you take home, but sometimes you can get in the way of yourself, i did. so i seeked help from SKILLED people. First of all i got my head sorted, then the rest fell into place, i would get on my high horse about how hard i worked and how skillfull this job was, i here myself in your comments a lot. but since i sorted my head out, the rest has just fallen into place. we are responsible for our actions. If someone put your life on paper and made a spread shgeet of your ins and outs and goals, it might not make sense the way you are doing it, thats what i was doing just going from one thing to another with a plan that was doomed before i started.

 

This man talks from experience. Very wise words imo.

[AA Teccie (Paul)]

Hi all just had pay review at work they class arborists as semi skilled craftsman ( along with grass cutters etc) and not skilled, what are your thoughts on this i believe we are skilled.

 

 

Done a bit of research on this, namely the dictionary definition:

 

semi•skilled (-skild′)

adjective

1. partly skilled

2. of or doing manual work that requires only limited training

 

A skilled worker is any worker who has some special skill, knowledge, or (usually acquired) ability in his work. A skilled worker may have attended a college, university or technical school. Or, a skilled worker may have learned his skills on the job.

 

And then I cheked out the Business Link and ACAS websites for further clarification but got nowhere really so I rang ACAS........................................................n after 10mins of waiting I kinda wished I hadn't as this old boy rambled on and on and on and on (Okay, I know, ME in years to come) but told me nothing really. Wished he's just have said sorry there's no strict definition in an employment context, it's open to intepretation.

 

One thing, yes only 'one', he did say that may be of use is to compare your role and grading with that of your peers, and he pointed out this hold be in the same sectors, i.e. private or publci service etc., and use that to suport your case.

 

Sorry I tried...but failed, boo hoo!

 

Cheers..

Paul

[Stephen Blair]

unfortunately a piece of paper is what is going to decide if you are skilled or not. I have a nice car and house, but that doesnt make me skilled. i have made most of my weekly wages from hacking down overgrown gardens with hedge cutters and a 046 and shoving it through a 10 inch chipper. now that isnt rocket science, doing it in a methodical, profitable way is a skill. Now doing a 1% reduction on a 300 year old beech tree over a graveyard takes a lot of skill, but if you are a climber on £6 an hour, it doesnt make you a very good business person.

 

When you work for a big company you have to fit in a box, the amount of boxes they have are limited on their page, so simply a few letters after your name will get you a pay rise, working for a small company, you are assesed daily by your boss, usually because he is sitting beside you in the van or on site with you all day, he doesnt need a tick box, he will just know how much he is willing to pay you for what you can do/make him.

 

this is why the self employed guys who run their own business arent bothered what you call them, because we are in charge of our own destiny, i class myself as a branch dragger/tree climber. i usually tell folk i work in mcdonolds if i get entered into one of those brain numbing conversations in a pub with a numpty.

[arbclimber]

I think it takes a man who is generally happy in his own skin, having genuine confidence in himself and his abilities to genuinely be unaffected by what others think of him. I have found some of the most seemingly confident people are infact the ones carrying the biggest chip on their shoulder and as a result are constantly overcompensating and seeking to bolster their true failing self- worth wherever they can. Be it seeking bigger and better job titles, more material posessions or praise from anyone who might give it.

 

To make it clear this post is not aimed at anyone. If anything it is a fairly accurate description of myself until a few years ago when I spent some time taking stock of my life and sorting my head out.

[Stephen Blair]

sounds like we have been down a similar road mate:001_smile:what made me realise that i wasnt as awesome as i thought i was, is when i became a dad. i realised then i couldnt cook a meal or feed my son properly, shopping for the right stuff was a nightmare. I used to think looking after kids was the easiest job in the world and an easy route for some, i thought what sat in my driveway or yard was the measure of a man:blushing: I think the unsung heros in the male world, are the single dads or carers of a loved one. i bet they would love to swing about in spangly shiny gear all day, but they arent, they are raising their kids the best they can, most go with out for years so their kids can eat and have clothes.

taking stock of your life is the best thing you can do if you feel resentfull towards others and if you dont feel you are getting recognition for your work.

 

I watch the secret millionaire, if none of you have then it is a real eye opener, folk that have succeeded beyond their wildest dreams in business,get thrown into a bedsit with £5 a day to get by on, they start off moaning and groaning, by the end of the week, they have usually had a personal breakdown of some kind, open their hearts up, roll up their sleaves and help folk that have nothing, they always come away from the experience a bigger better person.

 

contentment folks, thats the secret to life:001_cool:

[arbclimber]

Stephen, Without derailing this thread or making it a bit girly for an arb forum I think too that we may have had similar experiences. I was a skinny, arrogant little sod who didn't understand why the world didn't see how great I was. Turned out they had no reason to. Anyway i'm doing stuff to make myself proud now and if everyone else likes it then thats really cool, if not I aint that bothered. And i'm still skinny but thats cool too:biggrin:

 

Anyway back to talking about big dangerous machinery and stuff.

[Stephen Blair]

i shall dig out my stress thread for you mate, i think you will find it quite an eye opener:001_smile:

[RPA]

I believe that the skill of a good arb is way beyond that which we would normally associate with the term sem-skilled. In many industries arbs would actually be classed as muti-skilled.

 

But, if we were to be classed as skilled then what would Mattheck, etc, etc be classed as?

We have the ability to learn from the principles they bring into the industry, but are we actually capable of forming these principles from scratch?

 

Classification has always been and always will be subjective. I am happy being what I am no matter where someone else may class me.

[Mesterh]

we are proof that its an unskilled job. its not rocket science, climb up, cuts some bits off, if you dont want it to hit something then tie it on. when i got the blue tooth headsets for the helmets, i realised you could get a novice up to speed instantly, by talking in their ear telling them what to do, they didnt need years of knowledge, even up a tree , i could get them to put in little gobs, cut from one side, hold in a certain place. even reversing trailers and felling. remote controlling numpties i call it, and having the perfect birds eye view makes it even easier.

 

i am not saying i had unqualified guys swinging from tree to tree, but i had no downtime explaining stuff.

 

Yeah but could they do that without you guiding them?

 

I reckon I could perform a nice bit of brain surgery if I had a skilled expert talking me through every single step.

 

Surely all you need for that is a steady hand and lots of knowledge, probably just like every other job there is out there.

 

Lumping logs from one end of a garden to the other requires no skill.

 

To safely, in a controlled manor, efficeiently and without damaging anything/anyone section down a big nasty tree over a house, conservatory, sandstone wall etc etc does take skill. I dont see how anyone can think it doesnt as long as they do it in the above manor.

 

To crash it out, destroy the lawn, damage the odd roof tile, smash a few pieces of glass have a few near misses with the groundies,chip a few bits of sandtone and take twice as long doesnt require any skill and yep any muppet can do that that has a head for heights.

 

Its in the manner we do things that shows are differing levels of skill imo. I'm sure I could bodge a fairly poor table and chairs together but that doesnt make me a chippie.

 

I havnet got my head up my arse and dont diss what others do ie grass cutters(I've spoken to a few green keepers and there is a hell of a lot more to it than sitting on lawn mower) and especially groundies, which as we all know is a physically hard and very essential job.

 

Some of us probably dont realise the skills we have and use, and some others think they have more than everyone else and should be bowed down to(work with a couple like that!)

[arbclimber]

i shall dig out my stress thread for you mate, i think you will find it quite an eye opener:001_smile:

 

Many thanks mate. Just had a quick skim through. To say that your posts ring a few bells is an understatement. Ill have a good read of it later.