Getting rid of ivy!!

[ArbMish]

A trees own roots can girdle it.

 

This video is excellent for information about girdling roots.  One of Treestuffs Webinars. 

 

https://www.facebook.com/events/3768564116490289/

[Mick Dempsey]

3 hours ago, ArbMish said:

 

Edited March 3, 2022 by Mick Dempsey

[Stere]

Not convinced by thoose pics might be natural?

 

Quote

A trees own roots can girdle it.

 

Agree, & I suppose that means ivy roots could also, but not seen any reference to it.

 

As ivy doesn't  spiral like honey suckle it doesn't seem to girdle above ground.

 

[Mick Dempsey]

Ivy roots are not like tree roots, they’re brittle and do not have the ability to restrict flow up a tree.

[ArbMish]

 

Here's a better photo. You can see the indent on the right. To be fair it may have actually been ivy stem.

 

Almost anything can girdle tree buttresses and stem. Even relatively thin roots if they've been there long enough.

 

Oh and no that pipe was relatively new so had nothing to do with the girdling.

[ArbMish]

Agree, & I suppose that means ivy roots could also, but not seen any reference to it.   As ivy doesn't  spiral like honey suckle it doesn't seem to girdle above ground.  

 

 

  

 

Ivy can form complete cages around tree stems and braches if left long enough. It tends to fuse together more than spiral but it can still have a girdling effect. I wish i'd taken more photos now but large scale ivy removal is such a pain in the ass that you just want to get in with it haha. [emoji1]

 

[Joe Newton]

On 19/02/2022 at 14:21, openspaceman said:

You are engaging with experts in misinformation, such is social media

Don't argue with idiots. They'll drag you down to their level and beat you with experience

[CambridgeJC]

On 03/03/2022 at 18:26, Joe Newton said:

Don't argue with idiots. They'll drag you down to their level and beat you with experience

You’re right Joe. I’ve been quiet for a bit recently and have decided to do just that.

 

Wake up to reality guys…

The ivy growth in our area of East of England is becoming dangerously invasive. The advice to leave it unchecked to provide cover for wildlife is honourable in principle but misinformed in practice. 
I am keen to know how many years ago this general advice and policy for woodlands and countryside management changed to this handsoff approach?

 I suspect this official advice has now resulted in a serious potential catastrophe for our countryside. No more, no less. 
Unless we collectively understand the danger it poses we will be failing to manage the intrusive growth habit and unwittingly create a situation that can no longer be controlled. It may even already be too late. 
The time has come to open your eyes and see the obvious excessive negative impact on both hedgerows and woodlands. 
If controlled judiciously then ivy presents little risk and of course has some benefits but left unchallenged then it will take over as in my attachment photos and our hedgerows and improperly managed woodlands will be destroyed. That will be a major catastrophe for wildlife far greater than any removal of excessive ivy growth. 
Ask your mates and property owners... which side of this fence do you stand?

You arborists are at the frontline and you surely have the brains and eyes to work it out for yourselves. You don’t need a retired scientist to point out the obvious. And to deride me just because I hava a scientific background (see earlier posts by one contributor) simply shows your prejudicial mindset You know to whom I refer. As openspaceman said…don’t argue with idiots. Especially those who admit they are only engage for the sake of argumentation.

 

This is a serious issue.

Lets get the facts discussed properly and get collectively mobilised towards an effective policy on ivy control in the UK…before it damages our land beyond repair. 
 

All the green growth here is ivy…in March when uninfested hedgerows are already green with new leaves. Photos taken today. And by the way not a birdie in sight!!!

Edited April 8, 2022 by CambridgeJC
Spelling in the main by automatic spellchecker

[john87]

17 minutes ago, CambridgeJC said:

You’re right Joe. I’ve been quiet for a bit recently and have decided to do just that.

 

Wake up to reality guys…

The ivy growth in our area of East of England is becoming dangerously invasive. The advice to leave it unchecked to provide cover for wildlife is honourable in principle but misinformed in practice. 
I am keen to know how many years ago this general advice and policy for woodlands and countryside management changed to this handsoff approach?

 I suspect this official advice has now resulted in a serious potential catastrophe for our countryside. No more, no less. 
Unless we collectively understand the danger it poses we will be failing to manage the intrusive growth habit and unwittingly create a situation that can no longer be controlled. It may even already be too late. 
The time has come to open your eyes and see the obvious excessive negative impact on both hedgerows and woodlands. 
If controlled judiciously then ivy presents little risk and of course has some benefits but left unchallenged then it will take over as in my attachment photos and our hedgerows and improperly managed woodlands will be destroyed. That will be a major catastrophe for wildlife far greater than any removal of excessive ivy growth. 
Ask your mates and property owners... which side of this fence do you stand?

You arborists are at the frontline and you surely have the brains and eyes to work it out for yourselves. You don’t need a retired scientist to point out the obvious. And to deride me just because I hava a scientific background (see earlier posts by one contributor) simply shows your prejudicial mindset You know to whom I refer. As openspaceman said…don’t argue with idiots. Especially those who admit they are only engage for the sake of argumentation.

 

This is a serious issue.

Lets get the facts discussed properly and get collectively mobilised towards an effective policy on ivy control in the UK…before it damages our land beyond repair. 
 

All the green growth here is ivy…in March when uninfested hedgerows are already green with new leaves. Photos taken today. And by the way not a birdie in sight!!!

Exactly, I could go out and take photos of any number of healthy trees totally covered right up to their tops with ivy. Anyone that thinks it is not a problem or does not happen is an idiot..

 

I think it is a management problem as there are a large clump of trees not a mile from here that are in the middle of a loop of motorway slip road and so untouched. Every one, is covered to its full height..

 

john..

[CambridgeJC]

On 02/03/2022 at 17:55, ArbMish said:

On the subject of Ivy killing trees. Most trees are not actually killed by one singular thing but rather a number of contributing factors. For example with dutch elm disease: without the beetles that first infect the tree, the tree is less likely to be infected. We can say DED killed the tree but the beetles are such a high contributing factor that we can also say the beetles killed the tree. Interestingly in the 60s research found that Elms often recovered from the disease. (Peace, 1960) Therefore we can also assume that the stress brought on by climate change/pollution etc is another contributing factor leading to the death of the tree. 

 

In short, Ivy is a large contributing factor to the death of trees, whether by root girdling, windblown or canopy shading.

 

I have personally done a lot of Ivy removal in trees, where the ivy has reached within a foot of the tips. In general we remove ivy to just under the first branch fork on the main stem (roughly), this leaves a considerable amount of habitat for nesting birds, bees, wasps, butterflies etc and also in a lot of cases blocks the view into the garden for nosey neighbours  . I feel this is a good solution as the ivy is not completely lost as a habitat and will take a good number of years to grow back. At which point we are often back on the property to reduce branches from facades and remove dead wood, so the ivy can be dealt with then.

 

I have removed Ivy that has caused large indentations in branches, that has been half girdling roots/buttresses, has quite obviously shaded the tree and caused a reduction in canopy growth and has likely caused the death of branches.

 

It is plain to see after ivy removal that the ivy has caused a 'lion tailing' effect and normal crown growth has been effected. 

 

It is also important to remember that not only does ivy effect food production (photosynthesis) but also gaseous exchange (lenticels). I have seen trunks and main branches smothered with ivy and feel that it is safe to conclude that gaseous exchange must be to some degree effected. 

 

I have found that Quercus and Acers are the most heavily effected. However I have also seen Pinus heavily effected.

 

I have attached a couple of example pictures. In the first picture a significant portion of Ivy has already been removed. The ivy was right up to the tips at the start of the job. In the second picture it's hard to see but under the tree on the right hand side is a small tree completely overtaken by Ivy. It was almost completely dead.

 

 

(Side note if any of my sentences are a little oddly structured, sorry I haven't written this much in English in a really long time )

Here is an informed comment by another “junior” member with experience and ability to engage on this important issue without resorting to provocation to other contributors who may not have the same level of knowledge or experience as he clearly has. I believe the time has come to engage a wider audience to this subject as this ivy invasion will develop in short time to the point it becomes impossible to control. Please help me to engage as many people in this arborist community for their consideration of this issue. Time is running out for wider action which can only occur if the problem is raised across this beautiful land.