Gas is banned

[eggsarascal]

1 minute ago, kevinjohnsonmbe said:

That's not entirely the best way of looking at it though my old poached egg....

 

You see, in order for UK Gov to avoid the fines imposed by the EU for failing to reduce carbon output, it was deemed a 'bright idea' to incentivise Joe Sixpack to move off fossil fuels and onto renewables...

 

So, where as you are viewing the RHI payment as a 'burden' upon the tax payer, I see it more as a community minded self sacrifice on my part, by doing my small part, to help UKPLC avoid incurring fines which would be paid by the tax payer to the EU.  

 

It's a thing of beauty Egger!

Stop talking bollocks.

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

9 minutes ago, eggsarascal said:

Stop talking bollocks.

That's a genuine interpretation egger...  No BS! 

[donnk]

how much was the complete install, what BTU, who provides the warranty and for how long ?

[dig-dug-dan]

14 minutes ago, kevinjohnsonmbe said:

That's not entirely the best way of looking at it though my old poached egg....

 

You see, in order for UK Gov to avoid the fines imposed by the EU for failing to reduce carbon output, it was deemed a 'bright idea' to incentivise Joe Sixpack to move off fossil fuels and onto renewables...

 

So, where as you are viewing the RHI payment as a 'burden' upon the tax payer, I see it more as a community minded self sacrifice on my part, by doing my small part, to help UKPLC avoid incurring fines which would be paid by the tax payer to the EU.  

 

It's a thing of beauty Egger!

Once we are out of the eu though ......?

 

Back to original question, I know someone in a council house who has a pellet boiler, or costs them the same to run as when they were on gas. Bonus for them was council paid for the install. Their boiler is in an outhouse, so doesn't impede on the living space. They do have to but a pallet of pellets at a time, so unless you have some storage, its not great. Luckily for them, her mum lives on a farm nearby so they store the pellets and use as required

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

4 minutes ago, dig-dug-dan said:

Once we are out of the eu though ......?

 

Back to original question, I know someone in a council house who has a pellet boiler, or costs them the same to run as when they were on gas. Bonus for them was council paid for the install. Their boiler is in an outhouse, so doesn't impede on the living space. They do have to but a pallet of pellets at a time, so unless you have some storage, its not great. Luckily for them, her mum lives on a farm nearby so they store the pellets and use as required

It 'shouldn't' make any difference for a number of reasons...

 

The Gov commitment to RHI was made to satisfy the requirements at the date it was rolled out.  There was a significant delay rolling out the domestic tariff after the shambles that ensued from the commercial tariff roll out.  Originally, domestic was forecast to be index linked and for the lifetime of the installation.  It ended up as fixed rate fixed term (7 years) which was significantly less advantageous - but closer to what it probably should have been.

 

The possibility of EU fines for non-compliance with carbon targets by national governments may disappear, but UK Gov still has its own carbon reduction targets.  If they are seen to shaft existing subscribers, there is no chance of encouraging new entrants to the renewable technologies.  Carrot & stick - encourage 'good' behaviour, tax the hell outta bad...

 

The council house thing is an interesting question.  It is the owner of the qualifying heating system that draws the RHI payment.  So it might be that the LA is drawing down the incentive whilst the occupant is neither better, nor worse off...  I don't have a problem with than per se, after all, it is the person (or entity) that is responsible for installation costs that should be recompensed, not the occupant (unless the occupant put the cash up to install.)   

[trigger_andy]

1 hour ago, kevinjohnsonmbe said:

That's not entirely the best way of looking at it though my old poached egg....

 

You see, in order for UK Gov to avoid the fines imposed by the EU for failing to reduce carbon output, it was deemed a 'bright idea' to incentivise Joe Sixpack to move off fossil fuels and onto renewables...

 

So, where as you are viewing the RHI payment as a 'burden' upon the tax payer, I see it more as a community minded self sacrifice on my part, by doing my small part, to help UKPLC avoid incurring fines which would be paid by the tax payer to the EU.  

 

It's a thing of beauty Egger!

Im still looking at going the Biomass direction if I can save the cash needed before March 2021 when its cut off. Always something creeping up knicking the cash.  I'd be going the log route as I'm happy splitting logs and get wood fairly cheap. The System Ive been quoted for has a 2000l buffer and a 25kw Burner, self lighting etc for £18k, but Id have to build my own housing for it. Ie lay a slab and build a shed, might even have to run the power myself, we'll see. 

 

Speaking with a Lad off-shore who gets £900 back a quarter for virtually the same system he had some issues with getting the RHI approved due to the lack of insulation in his old house. Did you come across this issue? Would be a kick in the teeth for me to blow 18 large and not get the money back from the Government.  

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

44 minutes ago, donnk said:

how much was the complete install, what BTU, who provides the warranty and for how long ?

Ours has been in getting on 7 years now.  Can't remember instal costs but I could find them if you want.  I'm not sure how useful that would be after the passage of time though.  Kit has got better and prices have changed etc, etc.  

 

Similarly, I don't have the system spec readily to hand - but could find them if you wanted.  At the time we put ours in it was still 50/50 whether the domestic RHI would even be rolled out but my logic back then was, if it was, it would either be based on system capacity, amount of fuel burned or EPC for the house.  I reckoned tariff would be EPC based (what your house 'needs' to be heated) rather than the first 2 since the first 2 would both incentivise burn rather than conserve.  - The lesson learned from the commercial roll out balls up.

 

So you had to have an EPC  which identified the heat 'need' for your house.  The tariff was based on that.  

 

My 1 biggest 'take away' from back in the day was - ensure you are confident in the knowledge, capability and credibility of the installer and the kit being installed.  Even though I screened a dozen or so companies, I was still disappointed with the ability of the one we went with.  When I say 'disappointed', I mean it actually got to the stage where I was waiting outside the office for the bastard come out, but that's a whole different story.  It was a relatively new area and lots of chancers jumped on what appeared to be the gravy train without having sufficient knowledge or background to support bold claims.

 

I should imagine equipment warranty would be similar to most boiler units whether oil, gas or biomass.  The most important thing is set up, service support and willingness to work with the customer to achieve optimum operation which should be carefully measured against lifestyle and heating 'needs.'

 

At the time, I really wanted a log burner but they do require more human input and we were both working full time so I went for pellet which allows for much more automation.  Now we're both home all day I wish I had log but until the unit needs changing I'll stick with what I have.

 

That said, the system has been spot on for 7 years - it took a bit of 'learning' and some lifestyle changes to optimise efficiency but that is all part of the fun.  My system is an adapted Jaspi boiler with a woodviking burner head.  I've since become quite friendly with the import / tech agent and can phone direct if I have any questions.

 

Would I do it again. Absolutely, but the maths might not work if you end up ripping out a ½ life serviceable existing boiler to install a biomass.  New build or replacement of end of life boiler I'd say it absolutely makes sense.

[donnk]

we talking 5k, 10k, 20k ?

 

Trying to compare to heat pump.

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

4 minutes ago, trigger_andy said:

Im still looking at going the Biomass direction if I can save the cash needed before March 2021 when its cut off. Always something creeping up knicking the cash.  I'd be going the log route as I'm happy splitting logs and get wood fairly cheap. The System Ive been quoted for has a 2000l buffer and a 25kw Burner, self lighting etc for £18k, but Id have to build my own housing for it. Ie lay a slab and build a shed, might even have to run the power myself, we'll see. 

 

Speaking with a Lad off-shore who gets £900 back a quarter for virtually the same system he had some issues with getting the RHI approved due to the lack of insulation in his old house. Did you come across this issue? Would be a kick in the teeth for me to blow 18 large and not get the money back from the Government.  

I may be behind the current regs Andy, but unlike solar PV where there is a diminishing tariff rate for each penalty circumstance (lack of cavity wall insulation or loft, no double glazing etc etc) this was not the case for biomass.  Least not entirely.  Chummy came and did an EPC survey (now that's money for old rope!) and whilst it was noted that a 200 year old stone built detached house could not realistically be subjected to wall insulation, for example, it was not a penalty in relation to tariff rate.  So long as all reasonable measures were in place - led lights, majority double glazing, loft insulation etc etc it didn't reduce or disqualify from top tariff.  As I say, this was all 7ish years ago so no guarantee its still current. 

[trigger_andy]

Just now, kevinjohnsonmbe said:

I may be behind the current regs Andy, but unlike solar PV where there is a diminishing tariff rate for each penalty circumstance (lack of cavity wall insulation or loft, no double glazing etc etc) this was not the case for biomass.  Least not entirely.  Chummy came and did an EPC survey (now that's money for old rope!) and whilst it was noted that a 200 year old stone built detached house could not realistically be subjected to wall insulation, for example, it was not a penalty in relation to tariff rate.  So long as all reasonable measures were in place - led lights, majority double glazing, loft insulation etc etc it didn't reduce or disqualify from top tariff.  As I say, this was all 7ish years ago so no guarantee its still current. 

Nice one cheers.

 

Well, no loft insulation, no double glazing but LED lights.  Loft is an easy fix, the glazing not such an easy one, it will get done, but when? We're also in an old Stone Farmhouse.