Twin Rope Hazard (Self Rescue)

[Bolt]

Just now, Khriss said:

You don't - you post in on Facebook an make a mint  on the clicks on yr hilarious misfortune, possibly including dachshunds an yr poor choice of arb t shirt. ? K 

Dammit.  Mine’s a terrier.

[naturarbo]

4 hours ago, Rich Rule said:

Surely it shouldn’t matter?

 

You are based in Portugal, correct?

yes

[Rich Rule]

Yes, it matters?

 

or 
 

Yes, you are based in Portugal?

 

Either way, as ridiculous as the new guidelines are I don’t think you have anything to worry about.

[Treespasser]

I think this whole thing is total BS.

[Bolt]

1 hour ago, Treespasser said:

I think this whole thing is total BS.

By that, do you think the whole ‘two rope’ hype is just a mountain being made out of a molehill.  If so, part of me probably agrees with you!

[scotspine1]

1 hour ago, Treespasser said:

I think this whole thing is total BS.

 

I agree. 

 

This latest development with the enforced or mandated use of twin line systems is an example of top down bureaucracy by the Health and Safety Executive - it’s not a grassroots development that evolved naturally from within the climbing/arb community. 

It’s an outsider with limited knowledge of our work dictating how we should perform our work.

It’s almost entirely unworkable and totally impractical and in some cases downright dangerous (self rescue).
 

. 

[Bolt]

21 minutes ago, scotspine1 said:

 

I agree. 

 

This latest development with the enforced or mandated use of twin line systems is an example of top down bureaucracy by the Health and Safety Executive - it’s not a grassroots development that evolved naturally from within the climbing/arb community. 

It’s an outsider with limited knowledge of our work dictating how we should perform our work.

It’s almost entirely unworkable and totally impractical and in some cases downright dangerous (self rescue).
 

. 

But having said that, this whole 2 rope business only really affects SRT users, yeah?

 

(according to the draft ICOP).

Edited December 22, 2019 by Bolt
Wouldn’t be a post if it ain’t had an edit.

[scotspine1]

This video shows an Arboricultural Association competition/training event held in March this year. 

 

No twin lines being used yet they're the trade body of our industry who were responsible for the promotion and establishment of twin lines from 2005 onwards. You can see in the video that after 14 years they are still content to be promoting the use of a single line for movement through the canopy (with work positioning lanyard for cutting etc). There's nothing wrong with this. However, there now seems to be a lack of consistency with the Arb Association's approach to the promotion of twin ropes.  

 

In some ways this event shows the good work the AA do in promoting safety in climbing. They now need to be more robust in their dealings with the HSE and defend our industry and the work we've done to make it safer. 

 

They need to reject the mandatory/enforced use of twin line systems at all times in the tree.   

 

 

 

[scotspine1]

8 minutes ago, Bolt said:

But having said that, this whole 2 rope business only really affects SRT users, yeah?

 

(according to the draft ICOP).

 

 

A doubled rope system is a single line. It doesn't matter wether it's moving as part of a traditional system over a branch or a static SRT line. 

 

The legislation is for both DdRT and SRT. You need to be on two systems at all times from the ground up to the final descent. 

 

 

.

[Bolt]

@scotspine1 thanks for getting back.

 

I climb on the system that the ICOP calls MRT.

 

(A rope over a branch with an end attachment to my harness and a friction hitch / zigzag midline on the moving side.

 

Totally standard system as taught for decades. ) 

 

The section 2.4.7 of the ICOP as I read it requires me to incorporate a suitable back-up which the user must be connected to. 

 

I reckon I have been doing this for years using my longish rope / shorter rope system.

 

Where are you drawing your interpretation of the MRT system needing two ropes long enough to reach the ground from?

 

thanks :- )