changes to nptc cs 30 31

[Peter]

blimey guys!!! you have to understand that any climbing arborist MUST have CS40 and CS41 to do any aerial tree works!!!!!!! (afag805)

 

That is incorrect and misleading.

 

There is no requirement under any UK law to have any NPTC units to use a chainsaw professionally.

[john dawson]

if you want to be picky, then yes thats true. the law states you must have a certificate of competance. it doesnt matter what name is on it.

the nptc is the preferd system, because its the easiest and cheapest for employers to abide to, however the system still requires you to hold the ticket for the task ie section felling a tree is CS41. and NOT CS39. felling a medium tree is CS32, not CS31 wiv a bigger bar.

by law, i am actually covered by my NC and my ND to do far more than the nptc system, but every job interview has insisted on nptc. i have actualy been told in one interview that my ND and NC were irrelevant. needless to say i told him where he could put his job!!!!!!

my message is that you either make an effort to do it properly, or go home.

Edited December 27, 2009 by john dawson

[skyhuck]

if you want to be picky, then yes thats true. the law states you must have a certificate of competance. it doesnt matter what name is on it.

the nptc is the preferd system, because its the easiest and cheapest for employers to abide to, however the system still requires you to hold the ticket for the task ie section felling a tree is CS41. and NOT CS39.

by law, i am actually covered by my NC and my ND to do far more than the nptc system, but every job interview has insisted on nptc. i have actualy been told in one interview that my ND and NC were irrelevant. needless to say i told him where he could put his job!!!!!!

my message is that you either make an effort to do it properly, or go home.

 

Not every one is employed.

[bob]

Not every one is employed.

 

and you will find more and more are including self employed so working at height regs is a start as is loler ect:blushing:

[dillsue]

if you want to be picky, then yes thats true. the law states you must have a certificate of competance. it doesnt matter what name is on it.

the nptc is the preferd system, because its the easiest and cheapest for employers to abide to, however the system still requires you to hold the ticket for the task ie section felling a tree is CS41. and NOT CS39. felling a medium tree is CS32, not CS31 wiv a bigger bar.

by law, i am actually covered by my NC and my ND to do far more than the nptc system, but every job interview has insisted on nptc. i have actualy been told in one interview that my ND and NC were irrelevant. needless to say i told him where he could put his job!!!!!!

my message is that you either make an effort to do it properly, or go home.

I dont think ayone is being picky here- there is no legal requirement for a recognised qualification to do aerial work. As far as as I am aware the only legally required recognised qualification within the Arb industry is the use of a chainsaw covered by CS30( There are even exemptions from this!) There is a legal requirement for everyone to be adequately trained and competant, but as AFAG 805 states, this can be as simple as a briefing from a competant supervisor.

 

Lots of employers and organisations like to have formal certification for everything as an easy way to demonstrate that they provided adequate training, but thats only to cover themselves and not a legal requirement, excepting the CS30 for chainsaw users.

[treequip]

...........There is a legal requirement for everyone to be adequately trained and competant............

 

FYI

 

It's not a legal requirement, that would need a statute law.

 

It is however an HSE requirement that chainsaw operators should have recieved adequate training and be competent in using a chainsaw for that type of work.

[dillsue]

FYI

 

It's not a legal requirement, that would need a statute law.

 

It is however an HSE requirement that chainsaw operators should have recieved adequate training and be competent in using a chainsaw for that type of work.

 

I beg to differ on that one!!! Its my understanding that most, if not all, of the relevant HSE legislation(PUWER, working at height etc etc) requires anyone carrying out a hazardous act to be adequately trained and competant. Therefore, to comply with the relevant reglislative requirements(the Law) you must be adequately trained and competant. This is not just in arb, but in all work environments.

 

Regarding chainsaw training the following is an extract from HSE leaflet called "Chainsaws At Work"- "Before using a chainsaw to carry out work on or in a tree, a worker should have received appropriate training and obtained a relevant certificate of competence or national competance award. The bold bit at the end is how it is shown in the leaflet clearly putting emphasis on the wording. This statement is extracted from the approved code of practice supporting a PUWER regulation. The requirement for certificated competance may not strictly be "the Law" but you'd be a braver man than me to challenge any authority or court about the need for it!!!

[john dawson]

I beg to differ on that one!!! Its my understanding that most, if not all, of the relevant HSE legislation(PUWER, working at height etc etc) requires anyone carrying out a hazardous act to be adequately trained and competant. Therefore, to comply with the relevant reglislative requirements(the Law) you must be adequately trained and competant. This is not just in arb, but in all work environments.

 

Regarding chainsaw training the following is an extract from HSE leaflet called "Chainsaws At Work"- "Before using a chainsaw to carry out work on or in a tree, a worker should have received appropriate training and obtained a relevant certificate of competence or national competance award. The bold bit at the end is how it is shown in the leaflet clearly putting emphasis on the wording. This statement is extracted from the approved code of practice supporting a PUWER regulation. The requirement for certificated competance may not strictly be "the Law" but you'd be a braver man than me to challenge any authority or court about the need for it!!!

 

so what is a CS41 if its not a CERTIFICATE OF COMPETANCE??????????

 

the nptc system is the easiest, simplest way of bein certified. yet it also seems to be the most abused and most misunderstood. it is not the only system availble but its the only one that is requested by employers/clients etc.

[combined tree services]

i hold both CS40 and 41 BUT not every day do i carry out work that require these certs , in fact i would go as far to say that most of the time the job can be carried out without the requirement of 40/41. but to my knowlege there is nothing saying that i must not use a rope to lower a small limb if i do not have 40/41 neither am i aware that i can not carry out crown lifting or thinning opperations if i do not have 40/41 . and i have not heard of an insurance company that states you must have these to carru out tree work . how many guys on here actually have CS40/41 ??

[dillsue]

so what is a CS41 if its not a CERTIFICATE OF COMPETANCE??????????

 

the nptc system is the easiest, simplest way of bein certified. yet it also seems to be the most abused and most misunderstood. it is not the only system availble but its the only one that is requested by employers/clients etc.

 

I dont think there is any need to put "stupid" icons at the end of anyones comments. These are reasoned views that I always try to support with references to relevant authority.

 

CS41 is quite clearly a certificate of competance for sectional dismantling using lowering equipment BUT its NOT relevant if you are doing other work. No one needs a CS41 to climb a tree and take out deadwood with a silky-a CS38 or equivalent, will suffice.

 

My previous comments are not about tree climbing, dismantling, lowering etc etc- they say "before using a chainsaw" you should have a certificate of competance which is the CS30 or equivalent. This is exactly as my NPTC trainer/assessor presented the requirements to me.