Making the news today....

[Steven P]

also reckoned on the news that the thoughts are some of the hatches were opened, which also might have filled the boat with water - take away the air pocket inside and it won't right itself so easily perhaps. Another image I scrolled past was the mast broken in half sticking in the sea bed (just a drawing). Who knows, suspect many factors all adding up at the wrong place, wrong time.

[Mesterh]

You chaps are probably right in regards to the bad weather and needing specialist diving equipment. 

 

I've just read that they have found two bodies inside the ship.

 

[Johnsond]

The diving at 50m is well within the air diving range, hence we see Italian rescue teams using scuba to bounce down, they presumably are doing no deco diving judging by the limited bottom times being mentioned, but I’m not privy to what gas mix and dive tables they are using.  Scuba is not ideal for wreck entry as it’s all too easy for the guy to lose his way or get snagged up and end up a casualty himself. Surface supplied would have been far better with comms, camera, lights and a large supply of gas. I guess what was available at the time and how quickly were the determining factors. Air pockets sound good in theory but in reality it’s not the lack of air/oxygen that gets you but the carbon dioxide build up from exhalation. I guess the facts of the matter will come out once the hull is raised, which in itself isn’t a difficult task. 

Edited August 21 by Johnsond

[peds]

1 hour ago, Johnsond said:

The diving at 50m is well within the air diving range, hence we see Italian rescue teams using scuba to bounce down, they presumably are doing no deco diving judging by the limited bottom times being mentioned, but I’m not privy to what gas mix and dive tables they are using.  Scuba is not ideal for wreck entry as it’s all too easy for the guy to lose his way or get snagged up and end up a casualty himself. Surface supplied would have been far better with comms, camera, lights and a large supply of gas. I guess what was available at the time and how quickly were the determining factors. Air pockets sound good in theory but in reality it’s not the lack of air/oxygen that gets you but the carbon dioxide build up from exhalation. I guess the facts of the matter will come out once the hull is raised, which in itself isn’t a difficult task. 

 

Interesting. How quickly could you expect to see a significant response,  with surface supplied available? Is that the sort of thing most countries have a few hours sailing away from anywhere on the coast, or is it a one or two capable vessels per country sort of thing? Presumably it's a lot quicker to throw together a scuba team, regardless of how suitable they'd be for a prolonged job?

And how big a sea can people reasonably expect to see some kind of response in? 

 

[monkeybusiness]

1 hour ago, Johnsond said:

The diving at 50m is well within the air diving range, hence we see Italian rescue teams using scuba to bounce down, they presumably are doing no deco diving judging by the limited bottom times being mentioned, but I’m not privy to what gas mix and dive tables they are using.  Scuba is not ideal for wreck entry as it’s all too easy for the guy to lose his way or get snagged up and end up a casualty himself. Surface supplied would have been far better with comms, camera, lights and a large supply of gas. I guess what was available at the time and how quickly were the determining factors. Air pockets sound good in theory but in reality it’s not the lack of air/oxygen that gets you but the carbon dioxide build up from exhalation. I guess the facts of the matter will come out once the hull is raised, which in itself isn’t a difficult task. 

I was surprised that they haven’t mobilised more quickly to try and raise the whole thing, or at least set up an air-fed dive team. I suppose the scuba investigations may have fairly quickly proven that at best it is a recovery operation, with no lives to be saved. 

[Johnsond]

22 minutes ago, peds said:

 

Interesting. How quickly could you expect to see a significant response,  with surface supplied available? Is that the sort of thing most countries have a few hours sailing away from anywhere on the coast, or is it a one or two capable vessels per country sort of thing? Presumably it's a lot quicker to throw together a scuba team, regardless of how suitable they'd be for a prolonged job?

And how big a sea can people reasonably expect to see some kind of response in? 

 

Lot of variables Peds, there’s commercial diving going on pretty much everywhere including the Mediterranean at some point. Nearest DSV in that area and was it on dive ops or was a team In sat  onboard ? who knows but in reality it’s what was there at the time and often the insurance side of things and regulations can get in the way of the best method. The Italian's are very clued up with the diving game, I’m sure the police divers involved were very competent well trained guys. Use of Scuba commercially in the UK is a massive no no but we still have the Police using it too. The number of dive companies/ vessels available at any one time is down to many factors not just country or location, so no fixed numbers just what’s out there working. UK and Europe/Norway there’s always plenty, there’s several DSV with guys in Sat as we speak diving 24hrs a day in the North Sea and loads of Nearshore/ Onshore operations ongoing most of the time. Sea state is very much dependent on the dive platform, North Sea DSV will operate in 5-6m seas with a heave compensated bell, Air Diving 2-3m seas as long as you can give a lea for diver recovery. The RHIBs I saw being used by the rescue divers maybe 1-1.5 m tops. 
If you want to see what a decent DSV can work in you should if you haven’t already watch “ Last Breath “ .  
This is definitely the longest most civil reply to you ever, you have absolutely ruined my night 😡😂

Edited August 21 by Johnsond

[Johnsond]

1 minute ago, monkeybusiness said:

I was surprised that they haven’t mobilised more quickly to try and raise the whole thing, or at least set up an air-fed dive team. I suppose the scuba investigations may have fairly quickly proven that at best it is a recovery operation, with no lives to be saved. 

I’d say you are pretty much bang on,Reality is if you got off you lived if you were down below when it went under you were done for. There is the exception such as the Nigerian Cook rescued by a sat team in an upturned tug a few years ago but that is a one off. Recovery of the hull whilst not difficult id imagine will not be done quickly. 

[peds]

27 minutes ago, Johnsond said:

If you want to see what a decent DSV can work in you should if you haven’t already watch “ Last Breath “ .  

 

I saw it, absolutely mental. 

Yeah, big seas, I guess. 

 

Edit

Thinking about it again, that was like Mark Watney in The Martian levels of "yep, you're f*cked." Crazy that they got him back!

Edited August 21 by peds

[Johnsond]

1 hour ago, peds said:

 

I saw it, absolutely mental. 

Yeah, big seas, I guess. 

 

Edit

Thinking about it again, that was like Mark Watney in The Martian levels of "yep, you're f*cked." Crazy that they got him back!

Yep Chris was a lucky guy, general consensus is the loss of his hot water supply caused rapid cooling and a really high PP02 mix in his bale out ( emergency cylinders you see on his back) set up was what kept enough 02 in his system to keep him ticking over. Since then one of the subsequent actions from the many studies and lessons learned has been the nearly universal adoption of the “ cobra “ rebreather emergency back up system, this gives a far greater duration if you lose main gas. 

Edited August 21 by Johnsond

[peds]

Jesus man, charge your damn phone, I cannot deal with the stress of that 3%.